History of the Steelers-Bengals Rivalry
When people think of fierce Steelers rivalries throughout the years, they often think of the Ravens, Browns, Raiders, or even Cowboys. But the Steelers have played more games against the Bengals in the past 50 years than they have any other team, and the rivalry has seen its share of big moments and extreme hatred.
Show Notes and Links
- The 1974 game that was "too easy"
- The story of the leather briefcase game in 1977
- The wild finish to the 1982 game
- Keith Gary almost kills Ken Anderson in the 1983 game
- NBC announcers predict a TD in the 1995 game
- Carson Palmer "hates" the Steelers thanks to the 2005 playoff game
- Hines Ward prompts a rule change in the 2008 game
- Forgotten classic: the 2014 season finale
- The single stupidest meltdown in the history of sports happened in the 2015 playoff game
- The two disgruntled Bengals fan who flipped off Tim for taking this pic outside of Paul Brown Stadium (disclaimer: slightly NSFW)
Transcript
Tim 0:01
Hi, everybody. Welcome to the Pittsburgh Sports Memories Podcast. I am your co host, Tim Hannan, and with me as always....
Steve 0:10
Steve Wert. That's me.
Tim 0:12
So, Steve, this week, the Steelers play the Bengals. And I thought it'd be a good time to look back on the history of this rivalry. I think when you think of Steeler rivalries, you know, you think of the Ravens and the Browns and, you know, going back a few years, the Oakland Raiders or even even the Dallas Cowboys, and you don't always put the Bengals at the top of the rivalry list. But they're a team that has always been there for the Steelers. In fact, the Bengals are the only team since the AFL-NFL merger that have been in a division with the Steelers the entire time. So that means that the Steelers and Bengals have played each other more times since the merger. Then either of those teams has played any other team. Pittsburgh leads the series 67 to 36. So what's that, you know, basically, the Steelers have won two out of every three. So the Steelers definitely own the series. But it doesn't mean there haven't been some, you know, close games and definitely some stress it stretches where the rivalry was more evenly matched. And the way that I thought I get through this is to break it up into the five decades that these teams have been playing each other so we kind of go one decade at a time. So before we do that, Steve, you know your your general thoughts on the Bengals rivalry?
Steve 1:50
the Bengals the Bengals franchise or the rivalry with the Steelers both well the Bengals is a franchise haven't had much success unfortunately for Cincinnati and people in Kentucky and maybe that's because they've been in a division with the six time Super Bowl champion Pittsburgh Steelers maybe it's because you know there haven't been run the best over the years. But I think we'll get more into their history to begin with and but it's just the Bengals are just like one of those teams every once in a while they'll jump up and beat the Steelers but fight like you said like nine times out of 10 It seems like when it matters they can they're just one of those teams the Steelers seem to beat I don't ever really remember a big Bengals like where it's like oh heartbreaking Bengals loss. And there's definitely been at least a couple those with the Browns where the Steelers needed to win the game and the Browns were kinda in their way. Least no no less this last year in the playoffs but even before that the Eric Metcalf game and stuff like that.
Tim 3:04
Yeah, there's there's a few times we'll go through, right. There's definitely a few times where the Bengals have gotten the better or the Steelers. But yeah, by and large, it's it's been more and more one sided rivalry. But again, still still, I think a lot of good history and some some memorable moments. So let's, let's start. Like I said we're gonna do this by decade. Let's start in the 1970s. And let's actually start with the year 1970 because that's the year that the AFL and NFL merge. And the Steelers and Bengals who have never played each other before this are both placed in the AFC Central Division where they'll play each other now twice a year. The Bengals were a relatively new team at that point. They've been founded in the 1960s by Paul Brown. He's the same guy who founded the Cleveland Browns.
Steve 3:48
It's kind of like his hate is hate team for the Browns after he got fired by Eric ngmodel he just like to start like well I'm going to show you art modell. I'm gonna start my own franchise in Cincinnati.
Tim 4:01
And it was it was weird to he actually the Bengals have like the exact same uniforms as the Browns for a lot of years that they they eventually change and they go to their strike helmets and everything. But they had these plain orange helmets and an orange and white uniforms. And and they wasn't completely playing like the Browns just said the word Bengals on them. But when they when those if you look at like footage from the 1970s those two teams playing each other It looks like an interesting intrasquad game. Yeah, it does.
Steve 4:32
It does. I just it's just kind of funny how like there's like a whole NFL franchise was just started just because he hated the browns and
Tim 4:41
yes, NFL franchise found that out of spite. Yeah. So in 1970 not only are those two teams put in the newly formed AFC they're also both moving into new stadiums. Three of our stadium in Pittsburgh and Riverfront Stadium in Cincinnati. And what's funny about those teams damiens is they're almost completely identical. There was two other stadiums Veterans Stadium in Philadelphia and fourth Stadium in St. Louis, that were also very similar. And, you know, this was this was during a time when cookie cutter multipurpose stadiums were very popular. They could host football and baseball. And, and this design, it was, you know, whatever this design was, I mean, it's very similar. Steve, if you if you, you know, live in I live in a housing plan. You know, there's probably three other houses in the housing plan that look exactly like yours, the exact same floor plan and aesthetics. And that was kind of a design for stadiums back then. So three rivers and Riverfront. I mean, when you saw them on TV, it was hard to tell. You know, who was playing at home?
Steve 5:46
Well, it's gotten that way with baseball now to I've noticed, like, ever since PNC Park came out. It's like I don't know if they use the same architecture firm or something. But like, they literally have to put name like used to be like when you play the PNC Park, you get Oh, you have that little wall behind them. That's the distinctive look of PNC Park, and even Dodger Stadium you can but boy, now they have to put the names of the ballparks behind the thing or you wouldn't know you know, Wednesday in for another and I don't know the football stadiums really have like baseball stadiums because every football stadiums kind of the same. So I don't know if there's the same kind of aesthetic going on. But yeah, it's great to have the eska loser. I know that's not yet. That's in the news day. Yeah, yeah. Well,
Tim 6:31
we can talk about that when we talk about their their current state. Yeah, the eska. Loser. So say you think of the 70s obviously, is a decade that the Steelers owned. But in the early 70s. The Steeler Steelers are actually still building and the Bengals had a pretty good team. Cincinnati wins the division twice in the early 70s. So so they're they're actually the first team that's, that's good in that division, but it's pretty short lived. The Steelers, of course become one of the greatest teams of all time, and the rest of the decade belongs to them. Now, that doesn't mean that the Bengals totally sucked. They have a quarterback during this era named Ken Anderson, who is a borderline Hall of Famer, a lot of people argue that he should be in the Hall of Fame. He leads the league in passing yards twice. He's even then named the league MVP at one point. He just kind of has the unfortunate position of being in the same division as the 1970s Steelers defense. And and really, you know, one one season that really can just summarize everything. 1976 the Bengals only lose four games all season. But two of them are the Steelers. And as a result, they missed the playoffs.
Steve 7:42
So they went 12 and two, it missed the playoffs or no 10 and four, because there was only 14 games back then. That's right. Yeah, that's all I'm thinking of. Yeah. But but but still, I
Tim 7:52
mean, could you imagine that? You know, the Steelers last last year and the 2020. They they lost four games. And they were the number three seed in the playoffs? Can you imagine losing four games and not even being in the playoffs? And really that was by that was the only had one wild card back then. And so you really it was really important to win your division and because they lost both the games to the Steelers. They didn't win the division.
Steve 8:17
Wow, that's crazy. That will make me hate the Steelers, that's for sure.
Tim 8:22
Yes, for sure. 1976. Also, this season that Paul Brown decides to retire as head coach, but since he still owns the team, he obviously gets the name a successor. And he makes the rather dubious decision to promote his offensive line coach, a guy named Tiger Johnson instead of his offensive coordinator, who was a guy named Bill Walsh. And that decision will come back to haunt them but we'll get to that later.
Steve 8:49
Yeah, whatever happened to that Walsh guy? Yeah, well, we'll find out Tiger Johnson I bet was pretty awesome. Now, since I've never heard of him, or like 30 seconds ago.
Tim 9:01
It'd be pretty cool to have a football coach of the Bengals named Tiger but I mean, that's obviously why Paul Brown there had to be some marketing ploy that he
Steve 9:11
failed Tiger bill ties Well, we're the Bengals and we got to go with Tiger winning for Super free. Yes, he
Tim 9:21
won three. When? Yeah, only threes. He's no Tiger Johnson. One zero. So no, not at all him and saying one zero. Yes, I pretty sure I don't have to look that up to tell you that you're right. So there's three games that I want to just kind of cover from the 70s that are notable. The two teams played each other in the final game of the 1974 season. And the Steelers by that point had already cleansed the division and the Bengals had already been eliminated. So there was really nothing for either team to play for. The Bengals also had some injuries including One Two Anderson. So they had a backup quarterback and and Paul Brown decides to essentially just kill the clock for 60 minutes. The Bengals run the balls literally almost every play and don't do much else. Paul Brown actually only calls three different plays on offense the entire game. So it's basically like a game of technobabble only, like minus one of the plays. I literally don't have Bo Jackson. So right. I mean, literally, that's what he did. He called, he only called three plates. Like, he just kept calling them over and over again. And the one that he calls the most often is just a run up the middle. And he calls that almost every down. So basically, it's just like Run, run, run, punt. They just want to like, end the game and get out of there, I guess. And you would think the Steelers would maybe be okay with this. Because it's the last game of the season, they're about the end of the playoffs, they get to kind of just coast into the playoffs. easy win, but they're actually really ticked off about it. After the game, jack cam, Joe green, a couple of other guys all kind of sound off in the press about how they really wanted a competitive game to get them ready for their playoff game the next week against buffalo. And how they thought it was disrespectful of Cincinnati not to give them that. And this was a different time, you know, because now, you know, the Steelers in recent years, including last season, you know, they've had a number of, you know, the last game of the season means nothing. So they rest all the starters. But back then you didn't you didn't do that. Whether it was preseason, or, you know, the final game of the regular season, you just didn't do that. And so the steers actually are kind of insulted by this. They of course going to win the Super Bowl that year anyway. So, you know, I guess they were still ready for the the bills. But I just thought that was an interesting story about that game that, you know, Paul Brown just basically gave up and the Steelers were mad about it. It's kind of a weird,
Steve 11:58
that's a weird thing to do. But at the same time, like, like, what's the difference between that and like, like you said, What teams do now or they don't start anybody. They just started a bunch of scrubs. And I don't know what what to say like you. Like, don't you owe it to your fans to do something? I mean, where was this guy that with? This is in Pittsburgh, or? Yeah, I think it was in Pittsburgh. So like, basically, you ripped off all the Pittsburgh season ticket holders, which I guess if you're Paul Brown, you don't really care about. I'm, I don't know. Like, I would feel like if it was a home game. I feel like I owe my fans at least something you know, they bought a ticket and came to the game.
Tim 12:42
It's an odd decision for an old school coach like that, too. Because again, this stuff wasn't normal at the time, like you just play like you're, you're getting paid to play you play. And it was just an odd decision. So
Steve 12:53
yeah, and it's so you do feel like you know, they're the fans are the customers and you owe the customers something for their money and you can't completely rip somebody off. But I guess with the US customer. I mean, I guess you could debate to nowadays like would those customers be more happy if you win a meaningless game or the Superbowl? Well, of course, they're gonna be more happy if you win the Superbowl. So it did not didn't Billy could do that. Remember, one year, he didn't arrest anybody. And they ended up losing the next week?
Tim 13:24
Yeah. That was the 2003 final game of the season. And thank God he didn't because that's what allowed us to draft Ben Roethlisberger the next year. If we win that game, then then I think buffalo grass in front of us and they wanted a quarterback and we don't get Ben so well. ravens? Well, we would have got jp lozman. So I mean, would have been all right. Exactly. Another game of note in 1977. The penultimate game of that season for both teams was Steelers add Bengals, and the Bengals came into that game one game behind the Steelers in the division and Anderson throws for over 300 yards against the steel curtain defense and lead Cincinnati to an upset that as he puts the Bengals in first place and in control of their own destiny. All they have to do is be used in the next week, and they win the division. The Steelers are out of the playoffs all together. And again, this isn't middle of the 70s dynasty they were about to knock the Steelers out of the playoffs and win the division. But it doesn't happen the Oilers beat the Bengals 21 to 16 in the last game of the season, that sends the Steelers into the playoffs instead of Cincinnati and the Steelers are so appreciative that they actually take up a collection and buy every Oilers player and coach leather briefcases which Steve is kind of an odd gift for football players. I don't know why they thought leather briefcases would be a nice thank you gift but I mean, it's the thought that counts I guess. I'm trying to who is their quarterback? I
Steve 14:53
forget who the Oilers Dan passerini maybe he really needed like he was I kept losing all his plays. So you Bom Bom Philips is like hey you better get a briefcase to hold them in place. Hey the Steelers brought me one awesome him and Earl Campbell were like this is awesome yeah, I just I mean could you see Earl Campbell with a leather briefcase ever in his life? I mean I know a lot of things a Hall of Fame running back number one but leather briefcase just doesn't seem to fit his style. Yeah, big belt buckle cowboy hat cowboy boots, leather briefcase or something doesn't work here.
Tim 15:37
Yep. So that was kind of a blown opportunity for the Bengals and then 1979 the two teams the game they play at river front going into that game the Bengals are oh and six and the Steelers are five and one and on their way to their four Super Bowl title but the battle is not only upset the Steelers they blow them out three four to 10 when their own six and the Steelers Are you know on their four Super Bowl season so that that's kind of an interesting result there. Can you imagine Steve with Twitter was probably like after that loss. Yeah, I
Steve 16:08
heard Chuck Noll said that Jack Ham and all them yeah, they weren't allowed to be on Twitter that way. They're doing too much tick talking or something you Lynn Swann was just tick talking away on like the Bengals logo before the game and then cause the big stink.
Tim 16:25
I mean, yeah, losing to an O and 60 M I just can't imagine the fan base. Just, you know, fire coke. No. And now this was you today.
Steve 16:34
Well, this is 1979 so Stan Savran might have had his radio radio show sports beat 1979 Stan, what's wrong with Chuck Noll and the Steelers, I'll hang up and listen.
Tim 16:49
So that was that was a definitely a big upset but of course you know, by and large, the 70s belong to the Steelers. So moving into the 80s things things definitely flipped around a little bit in the 80s December 13 1981 is a big game for the for the Bengals Bengal 17 Steelers 10 at Three Rivers Stadium. It's really the Bengals first meaningful win in the series. And it gives the Bengals the AFC Central Division title that year. Anderson completes 21 to 35 for 215 and two, and he later says quote, that's the worst game was one of the most satisfying of my career. It really felt amazing given the ramifications that came from that game and it was the springboard for us going to our first Super Bowl. So you know, Kenny Anderson, who played for the Bengals for many, many years. That was a big, big win for him. And it did propel them to the Super Bowl that here where they lost to
Steve 17:45
fill. And 49 in Kenny Anderson was kind of the king of the what the Dink and dunk pass before it was, you know. I mean, he didn't really keep track of air yards back then. But I have heard that about Ken Anderson.
Tim 17:58
Well, that was that was the West Coast. I mean, that was Bill Walsh the West Coast offense. Right. So I mean, that was Yeah, what a typical,
Steve 18:05
and I guess well, I guess we'll go over that later in the podcast. But Ken Anderson actually plays a big hand in a Super Bowl win for the Steelers later. So
Tim 18:14
yes, yes, he does. 1982 is an interesting game because it's the only season in the last 50 years where these teams only met once. And that was due to the fact that there was a player strike that here and ends up being one of the more memorable fewer Bengals games. We covered this briefly in our episode we did about the att playoffs. The Steelers block a field goal, the Bengals are going to kick the game winning field goal the Steelers blocked field goal to send the game into overtime. And then in overtime, Dwayne Woodruff picks off Kenny Anderson. And so the Steelers get the ball in overtime and then this happens. Is this going over time? So that was a big win for the Steelers because the Bengals were the defending AFC Champions at the time.
Steve 19:21
You know, I'm not I'm not the smartest football like person ever. But you might want to cover a Hall of Famer, you know, I mean, there was nobody within 20 yards or Johnstone, they caught that in the corner of the headset. That I mean, you might want to cover a Hall of Famer there.
Tim 19:39
Yeah, it was it was the Steelers had the ball inside the five and I think the Bengals were completely 100% sold on the fact that Chuck Noll is going to run the ball here because that's what techno always does, and I think they just totally caught them off guard with the past. The funny thing is that so in 100 and Three meetings that these two teams have had only four of those games have gone into overtime and three of them are decided on touchdown passes.
Steve 20:09
I know one of them I know I know tool my guess that one there's another touchdown pass one that decided another one.
Tim 20:17
Yes there's there's so the Steelers won three of them and the three that the Steelers won out of those four are all decided on touchdown passes which you just don't see that much in overtime right you know, in overtime games decided by a field goal. Sometimes a running touchdown or turnover but you know the all three of those score Bengals games that went over time we're one on Steeler touchdown passes. So just a little fun fact there.
Steve 20:40
What was that San Francisco game where garrison hearse ran for like 100 yards, I guess. Yeah.
Tim 20:46
That was against the jets in 98. It was a 98 it was a 98 yard run I think. Yeah. And overtime. Yeah. So the Steelers got the best of the Bengals that day. But really the rest of the decade belongs to Cincinnati. They transition from Ken Anderson and Forrest Gregg was their coach at the time. They transition from those two guys to Boomer Esiason and Sam Weiss. The Steelers Meanwhile, as we detailed in our 80 Steelers episode, flounder for the entire decade, between 1985 and 1990. The Steelers, I'm sorry, the Bengals beat the Steelers nine out of 12 times. So you know, not a lot of memorable games there. But there is one that sticks out for me. It's on October 26 1986. The Steelers beat the Bengals 30 293 or stadium. And that's surprising because the Steelers are one in six going into that game while the Bengals are five and two, and really one of the powerhouses in AFC. But the Steelers not only win, they win by 21 points. And the reason it sticks out for me is because it was the first year game I ever went to. My dad had season tickets in the 70s. And then when my brother and I were born, he gave them to a relative and then I was about nine years old at that point. And he decided to start going back to the games and taking my brother and I and that was the first game that he took me to and I've been going to games with my dad ever since so that's a memorable one for me October 26 1986. And it was a game that you know we just expected to see or still lose by a lot and they win by a lot. So that's pretty cool. It's it's neat. See new actually remember a lot of anything memorable, anything still stick out all these 30 years later, however long that is I can't say I remember much about the actual game. I remember going I remember being there. And I remember you know, the Steelers winning being a shock. I can't say I remember you know who scored touchdowns or anything like that, unfortunately alone through a fast to Weegee Thompson or whoever you know, lips, right, right. Yep. So by and large, you know, this decade was mostly a reverse of the 70s where the Bengals were The Contender and the Steelers were mostly not the contender. The Bengals do you make it to another Super Bowl in 1988 where they lose two.
Steve 23:08
Yeah, that decision isn't haunting them at all. That's two Super Bowls a single Haley was because they pick Tiger Johnson.
Tim 23:15
Yep. Yep. And they lost that one. Of course in heartbreaking fashion. The Joe Montana leads last second drive and so the Bengals he has battles to Super Bowl appearances, but both times the 40 Niners beat them. There there is some animosity between these two teams in the 80s. It's nothing quite like what's about to come. Some years later, but there is some animosity. There's an incident where Keith Gary who's one of the Steelers many first round busts that decade. He literally rips the face mask off of the helmet of Kenny Anderson, which nearly paralyzes Kenny Anderson. Like he twists his neck around and he actually can't feel his legs for a while apparently pretty violent play. A lot of people in Cincinnati were upset about that one. And, you know, deservedly so. And then, you know, Steelers running back Coach daikoku who was with the Steelers for you know, I don't know, 107 years, something like that. He's the one that actually gives Sam wife, the nickname Wicky wacky wife after a wife screws up a game tying feeble attempt against the Steelers in 1987. So what had happened was this the scores are up by three there's only a few seconds left. But the Bengals had the ball in the Steelers 18 yard line and instead of spiking the ball and then running out your field with unit stop the clock I guess Weiss this ran out the field goal unit and time expired before they could ever get a kick off. So the game actually ends with them having the ball in the 18 yard line then or even attempt at the field goal. And after the game decode says quote Wicky wacky wife screws up again. So um, that name that nickname kind of stuck in SAM Weiss, you know, as we've detailed in some of our other episodes. It was was a little unorthodox as a head coach for sure. He didn't have a ton of run ins with Chuck Norris the Steelers, because again, you know, in that era, the Steelers just weren't much competition, you know, not the same as what he had with teams like the Oilers and brown. So that's the
Steve 25:19
I never thought like Sam Weiss was that bad of a coach? I don't know. I remember him having that. That name, but I was thought that's because he like called, like crazy play calls. Like he would just like, you know, I don't know, 1315 let's run the ball or something, you know, something weird like that.
Tim 25:36
Yeah. And he would, he would do stuff that was kind of, like not breaking the rules, but kind of kind of Bella check in, where he he'd figure out ways to manipulate the roles, like he, they had to make that rule about if you're allowed to, like, once your offensive guys are in the huddle, they have to stay in the huddle, because he would wait for them to you know, he, you'd have like three running backs in the huddle when he wait for the defense to put in, like all their, you know, goal line set. And then he'd like run out the running backs and put in like three receivers, you know, just like stuff like that, and, you know, stuff where they never had to have a role before that. But then they did. Now, like I said, kind of kind of Bella check in before Bella check. So
Steve 26:15
they do that in college, though, like I don't know, like, now they change your will to like, cuz they used to, like I remember, Pitt would always get mystified by this, like, and I remember North Carolina doing it a lot. And some other teams did it. Like, if there's like, you're coming out of like a TV timeout, like, you know, sometimes those are won. Like, they'll just huddle right on the sideline. And if you huddle on the sideline, you can have all 50 players standing there. So you don't really know who's coming out on offense. And they would just run right out to the line of scrimmage. So you would be stuck with whatever defense was out there. And so I don't know, like I noticed, like, like you said, like, I know they had to make that rule. But also there's ways around it like you'll see times where like, the quarterback, I'll stand off like five or 10 yards away while they're changing players, you know. So like, you can still substitute guys, you know, in and out as long as you aren't in the huddle, technically, I guess. But I guess we all think Sam Weiss for all that silliness.
Tim 27:18
He would have been proud. Yeah. So let's move on to the 1990s. And in the 90s, things flipped again. And boy do they flip big this time. Paul Brown dies in 1991 and his son might take over as owner and general manager and he flat out sucks it both jobs. those are those are those are two jobs he holds To this day, by the way. Some fun stats for the Bengals and or Mike Browns leadership for the last 30 years. They're the only team with three nine game or nine game or more losing streaks. During his time as owner, there's been 25 NFL teams that have started season o and six, and the Bengals are stiff six of those teams. They also have four of the 13 Oh, and eight starts during that time. So 13 or I'm sorry, 1/3 of the oh and eight starts. During that time. I've been Bengal teams. They've gone winless in October nine different times. And probably most significantly, they have zero postseason victories. Mike Brown is the equivalent of Bob Nutting Jr. He's an owner that just does the absolute minimum to invest in his team doesn't understand how to run a team doesn't understand when to bring in new coaches and when to fire people when to draft the appropriate talent. I mean, he just he's not good at being an owner or general manager. You definitely should not have both jobs. That's for sure.
Steve 28:50
I i when's the last playoff games isn't anyone I remember. I think we said that in one of the pot. Other podcasts? I can't remember.
Tim 28:57
It was 1990. They beat the Oilers. I know they'd be lawyers. Okay. And the next week they lost to the Raiders in the game that Bo Jackson are that's what I'm thinking. Okay. Wow. Yeah. They have not won a playoff game since 1990. Right since since Bo Jackson was in the league. So that's how long ago that was.
Steve 29:17
You realize there are people out there like 30 years old that have never seen a Bengals playoff win? Yes, that's correct. That's correct. You answered that like oh, like you're on the witness stand? Yes, Your Honor.
It's a holy cow. The math checks out. That's it. That is as bad as the fire. Wow.
Tim 29:42
Yeah, exactly. Cincinnati is the worst NFL team of the 1990s. They lose 108 games during that decade. And I think Steve I I couldn't fact check this but I believe this is around the time that my raincoat starts calling them the Bumbles. That's a book calls here. Let's say and we talked in our last episode about how Myron Koch came up with all this stuff that would just stick for years. I that's one that always stuck him calling them the bungles. I mean to this day that
Steve 30:10
they people still call them that in non Steeler fan like, it doesn't even have like ESPN announcers or bunco. Right? Right.
Tim 30:19
Steelers, meanwhile, are reborn under new head coach Bill Cowher, and they're one of the more successful teams of the decade. So during the 1990s, the Steelers mostly on this series, but again, that doesn't mean it's it's not competitive. Some memorable games from that era in 1992. The Bengals drafted this quarterback out of Houston named David Klingler. He was the number six overall pick, super highly touted coming out of college. I think he had a game in college where he threw for literally like 700 yards. And so I mean, you know, this was going to be the next great quarterback, his first ever start. That season is against the Steelers, and they sack David Klingler 10 times. And that's, I mean, that's more or less the end of David clinger like he never amounted to much in the NFL, much like every other Cincinnati pick that decade. And they had so many high draft picks.
Steve 31:12
I think that's the scariest part of is like, like, well, they may say that, uh, Kelly Smith like that, that was one of the and kajaani I mean, I can't blame them that cuz that guy was really good. He went to Penn State. I can blame my buddy, but he was really good in college. He was for Penn State. akili Smith, wasn't that good. And don't draft
Tim 31:34
don't draft Penn State running back. That's that's a lesser name, Franco. Well, yeah. And Larry Johnson had a pretty good career. But other than that, don't say running
Steve 31:46
for the Giants might be all right.
Tim 31:48
Yeah, if he doesn't get hurt every year, but we digress. 1995 there's a Thursday night game at three of our stadium. We talked about this in our 95 Steelers episode. Steve and I were at this game. It's very, very miserable memory for both of us. Jeff Blake this the Bengals had moved on to a quarterback named Jeff Flake at this point, and definitely was never a star quarterback. But two things yeah, he always be through a really pretty deep ball and he always seemed to kill the Steelers. And that game, boy did he kill us. I mean, he just was throwing these rainbows to darnay Scott and Carl Pickens who were there two receivers. In the Steelers at that time it rod Woodson and gotten hurt. They had a very patchwork secondary and definitely just destroyed them. Later that year, there's a rematch at river front. And that's another really memorable game because once again the Bengals comes out to a huge lead. But this time the Steelers actually come all the way back and score a bunch of points in the second half. And probably the most memorable play from that game happens late in the second half. And I'm gonna play the clip of it. It's interesting clip because the announcers for NBC are Deke Enberg, Paul McGuire and Phil sands. And Paul McGuire and Phil Simms literally predict this play before it happens and then openly route for kordell Stewart it's a past it's long past kordell Stewart from the Ella Donal. They actively like root for him to score during this play.
Unknown Speaker 33:30
Deck I promise you, Phil and I have already agreed to promises they're going to throw the ball down the middle one time to kordell Stewart because this guy looks like a racehorse. There's nobody near him. You know what it is? He's getting the slow there's all three receivers since the defense is playing solo so nobody can account for what is right down the middle of the field. This was in rubber river fried, right? Yes. Oh, there were a lot of Steeler fans. Yeah, that's
Steve 34:12
there was a loud roar when that happened. Yeah, that wasn't just phil simms and Paul McGuire that was cheering to Yeah, you remember them. I remember watching that game on TV. And I remember them calling that too. I remember them saying Oh, he's gonna score he's running down the middle of wide open.
Tim 34:30
Yeah, I mean, and that kind of just epitomized the Bengals of that era when they're setting up their you know, able to break the play because the battles defense was so bad. So yeah, that was that was a memorable game and a memorable play that kind of, yeah, help launch kordell Stewart into that slash role that everybody kind of remembers him fondly as a couple years later, there's a game again Riverfront in 1998. And this time Neela I know who threw that past kordell Stewart he's on the Bengals. And in starting for the Bengals, he leads a 93 yard last minute touchdown drive to beat the Steelers. And Carl Pickens, we mentioned him before the receiver. Talk about a guy that just destroyed the Steelers. He burns Dwayne Washington twice on that final drive. Once for 50 yards on a fourth down play 50 yard game. And then again on a game winning touchdown throw from Neil which came out of all things, a fake spike play. Pickens finishes that game with over 200 yards receiving and he was very good against the Steelers and Dwayne Washington was not very good for the Steelers.
Steve 35:41
Yeah, I remember why I think we watch this game over your house. And it was I just remember like, being so annoyed because it was Neil O'Donnell Neela dollar like, Oh my gosh, of all the quarterbacks in the world. Why Why you? Why do you like wander into against us and like, Dwayne Washington just couldn't cover like a jump past. Like, it wasn't like Carl Pickens was just running by him. It was just like these jump balls and like Dwayne Washington was the worst at covering a jump ball. It was it was bad.
Tim 36:12
Yeah, that was kind of Dwayne's, you know, career. Yeah. You know, he, like you said he'd never that's why he lasted so long. Because he wasn't he didn't get burned. If you asked him he would be on a guy. But he just had no like spatial awareness. Like he he could be there, he'd be on a guy, but then the guy would still catch it, for whatever reason. And that was just the story of Dwayne's life, unfortunately. Yeah. So that's the 90s. Again, Bengals were just beyond miserable in that decade and the Steelers were pretty good. So moving into the 2000s, some news, some new stuff for the new millennium. First off, you know, new stadiums for both teams. So Paul Brown stadium opens in 2000, complete with the ESCO loser. As Steve referred to earlier, they have this huge escalator that carries people kind of in and out of the upper stands. And you know, ESPN because the Bengals were still bad in that era. used to just always write any, anytime they would run the NFL primetime highlights, they would just always kind of end it with people filing out down the escalator like midway through the fourth quarter. So nice stadium but famous for the big escalator and then the year after that, Heinz Field opens in Pittsburgh in 2001, the first home game at Heinz Field, in Heinz rotisseries se against the Bengals. So new stadiums, but you know, at least at first it seems to be more of the same Steelers good, Bengals bad in 2001. There's an interesting game late in the season at Cincinnati, where the Bengals went in overtime. We talked about the four overtime games and see Where's one three, this is the one that the Bengals won. It's only the third loss for the Steelers that season and it doesn't really matter doesn't really impact their their record. The Steelers were very good that year, and they were still the number one seed in the AFC playoffs, even with that loss. But what's interesting about that game is this the reason the Steelers were dominating the league that year is because they had built this really stealth defense, and no one else could solve it. But the one guy who figures out how to beat it is Cincinnati's head coach, a guy named Dick lebeau, who you might recognize as having coached the Steelers defense in four different Super Bowls. He has the offense run out of a spread formation and Jon kitna, his quarterback attempts 68 passes and completes a lot of those for foreign during 11 yards and the Bengals when it's an unorthodox strategy to pass 68 times and run out of a spread formation, but it beats the Steelers and that I think carries over into the next season. The first two games of the 2000 Tuesdays and as we talked about in our Tommy Maddox episode, were against the Patriots and the Raiders. And they copied that strategy and they destroyed the Steelers defense and then everybody else was kind of onto it by then. And the 2002 defense became all of a sudden very easy to pass against. And that was kind of the end of that mini era for the Steelers.
Steve 39:16
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know who their offensive coordinator was. It might have been Bruce caused it or somebody like that. We ended up being I think he ended up being a head coach for them for a couple years. But yeah, somebody somebody figured it out. And then nobody figured it out till later that year. Charlie Weis and Bill Belichick figured it out. But
Tim 39:36
Right. Right. So things really start to change in 2003. Both teams are moved to the new AFC North division by that point in the Bengals hire a new new head coach named Marvin Lewis. Marvin Lewis is from Pittsburgh. From Fort Cherry, I think and was an assistant coach was yours in the 90s. So He's a guy that has a lot of Pittsburgh history. He's hired to say go to the Bengals the Bengals also that you're drafted quarterback from USC named Carson Palmer. Coincidentally in the same draft the Steelers select homers roommate, a guy named for Polamalu. The next year the Steelers draft the quarterback of their own kid named Ben Roethlisberger, from Miami of Ohio. And by 2005, both teams are really good. They both have these young stud quarterbacks, and for the first time and, you know, really decades, there's actually a lot at stake when these two teams meet. So the team that the Bengals are building is is pretty talented, but is incredibly unlikable. I mean, they just they thought their team was a bunch of guys who were either like criminals or just flat out jerks. They actually had nine different players arrested. In the same season nine out of a 53 man roster were spent time in jail. Chris Henry was one of those guys. When Henry was at WVU. Rich Rodriguez, the head coach at West Virginia stated that Henry was, quote, an embarrassment to himself and as a program. I mean, Steve, deep, can you imagine how hard you'd have to work to be called an embarrassment to the WVU football program? Like this is none other than rich Rodriguez. Yeah. I mean, this is a
Steve 40:06
Yeah. I mean this program is like questioning your loyalty that guy's really not loyal. I that's crazy. I'm Wow. I never had heard that quote before, but that's a good one. Yeah, I that I guess they just kind of fell into that trap and the Bengals aren't the only team that fall into this. I think the Steelers have fallen prey to this at times. They just see the talent and think, well, we can reform this guy or once he gets here we'll be strict and we can get him to change his ways and sometimes that works out but I think for my experience, most times it just is more heartache than it's worth.
Tim 40:49
For sure every team has fallen into that trap. I just the Bengals during that arrow seemed to stack guys that had that. That had that in the in their track record. Yeah, aside from the guys getting arrested, it's sad. Johnson was one of the more outspoken players on that team, aka Ocho Cinco. He was very cocky. Very, you know, look at me, kind of player who a lot of Steelers fans a lot of people in the NFL disliked a TJ who Simmons auto was our other receiver. he famously wiped his feet with terrible towel. Here's another guy that was very cocky. My favorite TJ Houshmandzadeh story that he told me years later, was that he was talking Troy Polamalu. He said something to him and swore out and then was pressed off game and Troy turned around and said, God bless you, TJ and TJ Houshmandzadeh two years later said, I felt so bad and I never said anything negative to him again.
Steve 41:49
One way to stop the trash talk.
Tim 41:52
Kill them with kindness. That's Troy for you. So even even TJ who from his auto who is you know, a class one kind of jerk? You know, he even felt bad about trash talking Troy so 2005 the Steelers win the game at Cincinnati, but as we detailed in our 2005 trilogy episodes, the Bengals win a late season game at Heinz Field and they win the AFC North, the Steelers have to win their final four games of the season just to squeeze into the playoffs as the number six seed and that sets up a wildcard playoff matchup at Paul Brown stadium. And you know, I think we all remember what happens in that game. On the first drive of the game. Carson Palmer drops back to pass Kimo von Oelhoffen rolls into his leg. And that's the end of carson palmer just totally shredded his knee and he's knocked out of the game and as to go through months and months of rehab. And so the narrative for that game, of course, you know, is all about how chemo was a former Bengal, by the way, injured Palmer on purpose and the cheating Steelers won the game Thanks to that, you know they really didn't deserve it. So that's that's kind of the narrative rarely mentioned is the fact that the backup quarterback in Cincinnati was Jon kitna, who had been their starter before Palmer got there and it was a pretty good solid veteran. And also rarely mentioned is the fact that kitna leads the Bengals to 17 first half points. I mean, if you score 17 points in a playoff game in the first half, you should be in pretty good shape. Right? But not not, not those Bengals, they reportedly get into a locker room fight at halftime, allegedly Chad Johnson and Hugh Jackson another you know, another winner, Hugh Jackson, are in the middle of that one. And keep in mind that this is at halftime when the Bengals are in the lead. So just you know, their immaturity and their inability to handle any kind of adversity whatsoever. This caused them to collapse. They surrender 17 unanswered points to the Steelers in the second half. And they're eliminated. And, you know, I don't want to underscore this too much. I mean, losing Palmer was big. It certainly was and that's a hard way to, you know, to, especially on the like the third play of the game, right. But, you know, what, couple of years ago the Eagles drafted a quarterback named Carson Wentz to replace a guy named Nick Foles. And they were having a really good season. And you know what happened when Scott hurt? And he was out for the whole season. And you know what the Eagles did? They didn't collapse in full they put Nick Foles back in. And Nick Foles won the Super Bowl against Tom Brady. So I'm just saying that you don't always have to roll over and die because you have faced a little bit of adversity. But but that's that was that was that team and the thing Steve I really hated about that team was I always thought they were fraught. You know, they they thought that because they had one good season. They were like entitled to some kind of championship caliber status. And they like they hadn't even played the call to the Patriots or any of the other superpowers in AFC. But But to this day, even they still insisted headlines. often not intentionally hurt Palmer that they would have won the Super Bowl that year.
Steve 45:06
Yeah, that's just the Bengals for you. That's that air of Bengals at least and I don't I don't understand that kind of attitude because like you said they never even played like the Patriots are the Colts nevermind beating them and plus a fun fact that chemo remembering chemo came to the Steelers Do you know how the Steelers got him? Do
Tim 45:29
you remember that? Dermontti Dawson. Yeah,
Steve 45:31
Dermontti Dawson couldn't block them and when your Hall of Fame center says hey, that guy's pretty good. There's there's like Alright, we'll go and get them.
Tim 45:38
Yep, so yeah, I just yeah, that was the Bengals You're right. And and because of that, that that's for that win has to be in in my top five most satisfying wins. Period any sport in my life as a Pittsburgh sports fan. You know, and then just to hear them whine about it. Carson Palmer, the Sports Illustrated did this big cover story about his rehab over the offseason. All he talked about was just how much he hates the Steelers. And it's like, Okay, fine. obsess about us. You know, we were off winning the Super Bowl. You were sitting there obsessing about us.
Steve 46:16
He cried about it too. Like I remember like, Oh, they should have never beat the Colts and they should never beat the Broncos and what they do beating the Seahawks. It's like, Get over yourself. Like you would have been able to do that.
Tim 46:27
Yeah, he's he was he acted like a fan on Twitter. Right? Like, you deserve detail. It's like your starting quarterback for the team. Like you worry about next season. Again. It's just a bunch of babies. It was it was so so satisfying. You know, it's not like beating Baltimore like it beating Baltimore. You know, there's there's been so many huge wins against the Ravens. But But Baltimore's a well run franchise with good players and when you beat them, your B it's it's feels good because you're beating a big rival who's a really big challenge. The Bengals were frauds, and it was so fun to just expose them as the frauds that they were. I have a clip here. And it's it's in a clip you'll hear two things go here. Joey Porter on the sidelines is kind of the second we're taking away and the fans were starting to fall out of the stadium. So it's really Porter taunting the fans. And then the second half of the clip is going to be bill cower in the locker room after that game mocking the Bengals who de chant
I love that. That was great cower just totally totally mocking that's the Bengals if you don't know that's their big I don't know if Steve What do you call it talent or key or whatever?
Steve 48:04
I guess yeah, I always thought that was a but what New Orleans is gn but I guess it's Cincinnati. I don't know. Maybe there's a large Cajun population in Cincinnati. They come off the Mississippi River that far. I don't
Tim 48:18
whatever. Who cares. It's stupid. Did they stop
Steve 48:20
at Cincinnati? Why don't they just keep coming up? Because
Tim 48:25
it was it was just it was so funny. Here. cower, mock them. One last footnote from that game. Joey Porter. This is what he said about that game shortly afterwards. He said, quote, I didn't care if Palmer was heard or not. So I was the bad guy. Once again. I laughed at their sorrows. Ha ha ha. And just keep that in mind. Oh, Jerry Porter. Just keep that in mind because Porter would once again factor into a Steelers Bengals huge game many years after his career and that's kind of the end of that era for the Bengals too. There is one more very satisfying victory the next season. So in 2006 the Steelers don't have a very good season as defending Super Bowl champions and their way eliminated from the playoffs in the last game of the season. They're playing in Cincinnati was a chance to eliminate the Bengals from the playoffs and build cars click before this game was something like misery loves company. So the Steelers had nothing to play for but they they could knock the Bengals out of the playoffs. And that game actually goes into overtime
Steve 49:34
and saying they called more than the same three running plays.
Tim 49:37
Yeah. Yes, they did. Yeah, no coward did not run the ball in the middle. In fact, in overtime, they did this. Back shirt drop quick slant on his way up the left sideline. He is going he is going he's just down Nice. So that's that was the end of the Bengal season that year thanks to San Antonio Holmes in the Steelers, and that's actually both our final ever game is head coach. And so his final ever play as head coach is a 67 yard touchdown reception by Holmes in overtime to eliminate the balance from the playoffs and I can't think of a more fitting way for Coach Gower to go out and that
Steve 50:26
that's that is a quite awesome way to go out for a coach cower. I wish I wish he could have made the playoffs one last time maybe ended on the Super Bowl but a good for good for Bill and you know I can't see why the Bengals fans don't like the Steelers at all. I mean
Tim 50:42
Oh wait, you haven't seen anything yet.
Steve 50:44
Could you imagine being like a Bengals fan? That's like 60 or 70 years old. You've had to live through all this? I yeah, there's no way you're still fan at the like you've given up on the Bengals or maybe you're like, like it's like pit football where you give up on them for a while and then they get good and you go back in again and say oh, why am I a fan? This is like very like pit football ask. Like just the pain just never stops with the bagels.
Tim 51:11
Yeah, pretty. Pretty much. Speaking of the pain with the Bengals by 2008. When the Steelers are on their way to a second Super Bowl victory, the Bengals start that season oh and eight. And there's a game on October 19 of that season where the Steelers blow out the Bengals in Cincinnati. That game is notable because Hines Ward breaks the jaw of Bengals linebacker Keith rivers on and just an absolutely vicious block. Rivers was the Bengals first round pick that year and that that hit actually ends his season. And the NFL so constitutes a roll after that. called the Hines Ward roll where I guess you're not allowed to hit people too hard or something like that.
Steve 51:51
You're not allowed to block a guy. It's like a blindside block. Like while going towards the goal line or something like that. You have to come from the side or something stupid. It was literally blocking too hard. He I think he did get a paddle. I think I did Heinz or get a penalty.
Tim 52:08
I know. He didn't, because it was legal at the time. But then, you know, the NFL had to step in and player safety blah, blah, blah. So but that was that was memorable. I was I was at that game. Steve. My. My dad's birthday is on October and my brother and I for his birthday here. We got tickets and did a road trip to Cincinnati. And I have to say, you know, Cincinnati fans say what you want. They were definitely very friendly to us that day. I remember one guy ran up to us. We're all wearing our car gear. One guy ran up to us and started yelling something about you know, how's the students something negative about the Steelers? And he just kind of pauses like no, not really, we suck. In walking out of the stadium, there were these two guys that had bags over their head. They were holding up this giant sign that said fire Mike Brown. I had my camera with me. I was taking pictures and I snapped a picture of these two guys. And only like months later, I was looking at my pictures. And I noticed that when I snapped the pictures one of the two guys flipped me off.
Steve 53:15
I do blame them. I know.
Tim 53:18
Hilarious. I thought I thought it was so funny. I didn't I didn't I didn't even realize it at the time until I looked at the picture. But it was a I was I'll put I'll post that picture on our website because it was it was really funny. Also of note in 2008 Steve, you mentioned this earlier, Kenny Anderson finally gets a Super Bowl ring. Ironically as the quarterback coach of the Steelers, so after all those years in the 70s of not being able to win a Super Bowl. You know thanks in large parts of the Steelers. Kenny Anderson gets a Super Bowl ring with the seal are so good on Kenny Anderson there Yeah, yeah, it's kind of weird that there's like that thick lebeau connection and then Kenny Anderson connection so there's some weird like Bengals Steeler connections for whatever reason I don't know maybe it's just farming Lewis to cuz he was on Yeah, staff for I think I'm pretty sure he was on that 95 staff that went to the Super Bowl. So he was on our staff for a while too.
Steve 54:18
Yeah, it's definitely a weird thing like that. So I don't know what to make of it. Maybe the NFL is just like that. They hire a lot of assistants from other teams and stuff. So
Tim 54:29
yeah, yep. So let's go into the 2000 10s and the 2000 10s of Bengals done with the arts, with the arts. And in the 10s the Bengals have a resurgence. They have a new group of stars including the red rifle himself. Andy Dalton quarterback and they actually make the playoffs six times between 2009 and 2015. Steve Did you remember that they made the playoffs six times.
Steve 54:57
I do remember them being kind of new. mediocre and this guy which is sad because it's probably like the golden age of Cincinnati Bengals football and like they're pretty mediocre. Everyone's like why oh, they're gonna be good. It's like, I don't know. They're just kind of okay. It's like, I don't know. Like and then same thing with the Andy Dalton Andy Dalton isn't a bad quarterback, but like God wouldn't put him in even the same league as like a trend. Well, he's better than Trent Dilfer, but I'm trying to think like somebody like that's just kind of like a Nick foles would Yeah, I don't
Tim 55:32
I maybe like Kirk Cousins about like somebody like
Steve 55:35
yeah, it's like he gets lots of a lot of stats, but he never really seems to win the even the big regular season games. Nevermind a big playoff game. So I don't know at least Nick foles has that going for me seems see Nick foles is like the opposite. He seems like he saves all his wins for the playoffs. In the playoffs. He's like Superman.
Tim 55:57
I just would not have guessed six playoff appearances between oh nine and 15 I just I just would I remember them you know, like he said being you know, decent, but six playoff variants. I just wouldn't have guessed that but
Steve 56:09
didn't them and it seemed like them in Houston played every every wildcard weekend. It was like oh, it Cincinnati in Houston again, it's like okay, and like neither those teams were gonna contend for the Superbowl. Yeah, it was just like, okay, it's just like the opening preview of like before patriots play somebody that the second best team in the AFC
Tim 56:29
that year? Yes. It was like there's like the playing game for the NCAA Tournament.
Steve 56:35
Even Davidson and you know,
Tim 56:39
Central Kentucky tech or whatever. Yeah. The Steelers have a couple of down seasons, but by 2014. They're contenders again. And that season 2014. The Steelers and Bengals play on the final week of the season at Heinz Field. They decided to division, both teams that already clinched a playoff spot, but that game was for the division. And that's that's one of the really great games that probably won't be always remembered. But it was a super competitive game. A lot of big plays Antonio Brown, absolutely dominates that game. He has a 71 yard punt return, touchdown and a 63 yard touchdown reception dice the game late. It's a great game, but unfortunately it ends up working out badly for both teams. The Steelers lose levy on bell to an injury and the Bengals lose AJ green their star receiver. And you know both teams, the Steelers and the Bengals lose their subsequent playoff games the next week, largely due to missing their their offensive stars. So the rivalry is back at this point. And it's really starting to turn ugly. There's a bunch of incidents This is a not totally complete list but here's here's some of the things that were notable Pittsburgh linebacker Terrence Garvin number Terrence Garvin, Steve. No, no no yeah. Anyway, Pittsburgh linebacker Terrence Garvin breaks the jaw and neck of Cincinnati's punter on a hit and draws a $25,000 fine from the league. I think that was on a Antonio brown punt return and Garvin just levels the Cincinnati pattern breaks his neck. So a lot of people insist that hey, we're upset about that one. Mike Tomlin and Daniel safety writing Nelson get into it after a game. Tomlin was upset about a late hit. I think that was actually the game that I just referenced for Belle got hurt. And the guy that hit him was Nelson and Tomlin felt like that was not a clean hit. And they got into it after the game. Mike muntjac Hall of Fame offensive line coach also gets into into it with Nelson in a different game. And this one was not after the game is actually during a game and draws a personal foul penalty. So you know, pretty interesting note on my tax career that he incurred a personal foul call 20 years after his retirement.
Steve 59:01
Whenever I remember that Mike munchak they like Didn't he like grab his head
Tim 59:05
grab this. He grabbed his hair because Reggie Nelson had like dreadlocks sticking out of his helmet. And I think Nelson kind of ran into him and Munch I took such into it. Yeah, his hair. And I got your flag. But that was just kind of fun.
Steve 59:18
Like manchac was the standard like you know, sometimes they stand like right at the edge of this. Like he was like well into the bench too, if I remember correctly,
Tim 59:26
but yeah, Nelson probably did it on purpose. I'm just gonna assume that well, one guy you know right raging Nelson had some run ins with Steeler coaches but the guy that was really at Ground Zero and all this likeliness there's a guy named vontaze burfict Bengals linebacker. He knocks living on bail out for the season in 2015. And then celebrates the hit after the play. A lot of the Steelers players were really pissed off about that one Ramon foster says quote, that's what type of guy he is, and he'll get his Perfect and Vince Williams and Dame terrorists and get into a pregame skirmish before 2015 game. Steve James Harrison's other guy that kind of crossover between teams. He spent that year with the Bengals remember? Perfect kicks Roosevelt next during a game and he also gets fined for dirty hits on Antonio brown and James Conner and another game. So Vaughn says perfect was was definitely public enemy number one for the Steelers and their fans. Pretty much the whole time he played in Cincinnati.
Steve 60:30
He just didn't it wasn't just the Steelers to like I remember there was a game with Cam Newton and Carolina like remember that he was like twisting his like foot after like, like his ankle and stuff after the play was over. In like in the league, just let that go on and on and on. Like a Steeler play like Harrison was with the Steelers would like just sneeze on somebody. And the league would be like, $10,000 fine, we'll have perfect like, at some point, don't you need to go to go to like the soccer role where like, you've accumulated so many, you know, fat personal files, like in soccer, you get so many yellow cards, they start to suspend you from games. And that's, that's what I always felt like, if you're if you're really serious about player safety, and blah, blah, blah, and whatever, this isn't just willing window dressing, then you need to come up with a rule. Like if you get so many personal fouls, you're suspended for a game. And then you know so many and then you get so many more your expanded for six games, and then it's a year and then it's a playoffs or, or even better just suspend somebody for the playoffs. You know, if your team makes the playoffs or whatever team you go to, if that team makes the playoffs, you're not at the play in the first playoff game whenever that is and see that that'll put it and the guys like him and the way they're gonna clean up their act are a team team can't afford to pay a guy like that to not play in the playoffs.
Tim 61:56
So so they eventually the NFL eventually does do that. It's it's not until years later, it's when burfict is playing for the Raiders. He hits a guy in the head for the Colts and they suspend them for an entire rest of the season. It was in like week four or something.
Steve 62:11
Yeah, they finally did something about it, but it was too little too late. I it just they they should just come up with a policy just just a road policy. You know, you get so many personal fouls, you're out for one game and then if you come back and you get you know one or two more you're out for six games you know just in then you're all for playoff games, and that'll that'll be the guys either gonna like just adjust his play or he's gonna be out of the league and either one is fine with me and I would say if it was a steal or whatever.
Tim 62:42
Yeah, I agree you know making its objective and making it you know, NFL discipline when they feel like finally disciplining it that's way too subjective. And, and like you said, because of that he was allowed to you have caused a lot of chaos for a lot of years.
Steve 62:57
And it wasn't just what the Steelers they want it really wasn't it really wasn't. It was like I said there was a it just like, like I said, it wasn't like oh, like some time or one time Harrison hit a wide receiver from Cleveland. It was kind of questionable that maybe didn't hit him in the shoulder, maybe in the shoulder slid into his head. No, like, Cam Newton was literally laying on the ground and he's sitting there twisting his ankle. Like, that's not part of any part of football. He wasn't advancing the ball. He's laying on the ground. He's already down. That's literally intent to injure. I don't understand why. I don't understand why he was so why the league was so lenient towards him and not other people. So
Tim 63:40
yep, totally agree.
Steve 63:43
Yeah, it wasn't like he played for New York or some I don't know. And that's enough about perfect.
Tim 63:48
Yeah, I mean, you're I mean, you're spot on. You're absolutely right. It's there was no reason why he should have been allowed to, to cause chaos for as long as he caused chaos for so the Steelers Bengals quickly kind of becomes a cringe worthy affair. Whenever they play each other. In 2015. The Bengals put together one of the best seasons that they've ever had, they go 12 and four, and they win the division and the only other times that the Bengals won that many games. They made it to the Super Bowl both times. So that was that was a banner year for the Bengals going 12 and for the Steelers that year squeezed into the playoffs with some help on the last week of the season from the Buffalo Bills. And that sets up a second Steelers Bengals playoff game almost 10 years to the day after the first one and oh my Is it the mother of all Steeler Bengals games. Again, the game is in Cincinnati just like it was a decade earlier and again. The Bengals have a problem at quarterback Andy Dalton had been injured before the game It wasn't the Steelers fault this time.
Steve 64:51
A key move on often was well retired.
Tim 64:56
They have to start AJ McCarran at quarterback. And that definitely hurts their offense. The Steelers build a 15 to nothing lead into the fourth quarter. But burfict hits Ben with yet another team shot and then has to be carted off the field. Classy, Bengals fans as Ben's been carted off the field, held him with beer cans. And here as he's being carted off the field was very severe so they thought he was thirsty. Uh huh. Yeah, I'm sure that was it. So without Ben Roethlisberger the Bengals are able to mount a huge comeback. McCarran hits AJ green for go ahead touchdown with two minutes left. Landry Jones is in the game for the Steelers playing like Landry Jones, he you know he comes in to try to lead a last second drive and he throws what is presumably a game ending interception to have all people found that's perfect. Did Mr. cheap shot artists? Yeah. And it's just it's I the feeling at that moment was so low Steve because here the Steelers are gonna lose a playoff game because perfect took out. It was the season that perfect to take it out. levy on bill. So we didn't have levy on Bell because perfect took him out. And then he takes out Ben, and then he's going to get the game ending interception. I mean, it just it wasn't right. Like wasn't justice.
Steve 66:20
Well, until it's like this after the NFL like member cracked out on the Steelers for hitting people too hard. But now the Bengals are allowed to do it. Yeah, it's Yeah,
Tim 66:29
it you know, it was a terrible feeling. Well, what happens next will be talked about for I think generations because it's still to this day, I can't believe it happened. So the Bengals are trying to kill the clock at this point. They're doing they run the ball with Jeremy Hill. They're running back. He stripped by Ryan saisir and the Steelers get the ball back. I mean, I think you know, if not for what happened next. That would be remembered as one of the biggest errors of all time because at that point in the game. You're just holding on to the ball. You're just trying not to fumble. You're already in field arrange. That's all you have to do. Just don't fumble and Jeremy Hill fumbles. Ben then limps back out onto the field. I guess they figured that Ben Roethlisberger with, you know, 10% of his shoulder was better than Landry Jones with 100% of his shoulder. You know, and that was pretty amazing. Because remember, he was he wasn't that he got just got hurt. He was carted off the field. But he lives back on there, he attempts to lead the Steelers on the last second drive. And he does make a few plays including a fourth down conversion. But he can't. It's pretty obvious he can't throw the ball more than five or six yards. So they're just trying to like think their way down the field, five or six yards at a time. And that's not really working because they get the ball to bounce midfield. There's 20 seconds left, but they're out of timeouts at this point. So that means they have to throw towards the sidelines, they have to at least take a shot somewhat deep. It's also raining. Which means that Yeah, the Steelers can't exactly attempt a 40 or 50 yard field goal because the weather's ugly. So still, even with the Jeremy Hill fumble the odds of the Steelers pulling us off are slim to none at this point. Roethlisberger attempts to pass over the middle of brown. It's incomplete. But he's hit in the head by who else vontaze burfict draws a 15 yard personal foul penalty. Brown is concussed on the play. He's lying on the field and being attended to one of the guys out there helping him off the field is Joey Porter, who is now an assistant coach for the Steelers and
Steve 68:46
Jerry Porter.
Tim 68:49
Whether whether or not porters allowed to be out there is kind of up for debate. But regardless, he's out there and he and PacMan Jones start joking with each other because Porter was the bad guy again haha. And Jones inexplicably tries to throw a punch at Porter from like a mile away. Like he wasn't even close to him and he tries to just take a swing at them. It's an official in the back of the head instead. And he gets flagged for a 15 yard penalty. So the Steelers literally get 30 yards by doing nothing. They trot out rookie kicker Chris Boswell he calmly drills the game winning field goal and the Steelers walk away with the victory and the Bengals are eliminated in what was their best season since their Super Bowl year. It's I'll just say it bluntly. It's the stupidest collapse in the history of sports.
Steve 69:45
I this is worse than Buckner I can't even think Yeah, or like Jose de la Francesco Berra
Tim 69:54
or, yeah, or the Falcons losing the lead to the pay. I mean, those are all really bad. At least the other team made plays
Steve 70:01
Literally just stood there. Right haven got it.
Tim 70:05
Right and the perfect hit on brown I mean if it if that were any other player because sometimes you know on a play on a bang, bang play over the middle sometimes you hit a guy in the head it's not necessarily on purpose you know, and they're just gonna call anything that's helmet to helmet. But that was that was a perfect plate it wasn't a surprise that he would try to lead with his head you know, and as bad as that was Pac Man Jones I mean, another another fine West Virginia alum you know, what are you doing? Like it's an assistant coach who retired years ago. Why are you getting in a fight with him and why in the in the name of all things holy. Would you throw a punch at him? I mean, it's just the dumbest thing ever. The Bengals have the game one they melt down the hand the Steelers of victory and and you know he talked about they talked about the top five most satisfying wins. This one's in here too. I mean, both of those playoff games in the Bengals against the Bengals were just in my top five most satisfying wins. And yeah, it sucked. You know, brown didn't play the next week. And Ben was hurt and Bell was already hurts. Perfect took out our whole offense that year and we lost the divisional round to Denver in a really close game. However, it was worth it to just beat them in that fashion. Well,
Steve 71:25
if you don't remember Pac Man Jones went on the Dan Patrick show the next week in stated that Antonio Brown was faking a concussion so to be PacMan Jones and the Cincinnati Bengals the Steelers organization literally held him out against Denver just to beat you just to prove a point that he really wasn't concoct what kind of insane a it Dan Patrick sit there and it just like didn't question it just like sat there accepted it with a straight face like I that's still to this day and how many years ago this still annoys me so up wonder why nobody takes the media serious anymore. Yeah. What when you just like crap like that gets said and don't even challenge it. Come on, man. I that's that's the quote. Our current president that's ridiculous, though.
Tim 72:15
Yeah, that that was that was embarrassing. I mean, it was embarrassing enough, the way they lost but then the way they carry themselves afterwards. And then he was also very upset that you know, Porter was even out there, Jeremy. Yeah, Jerry didn't even call him the right name. Was Jerry Porter going out? I mean, it's just, it's just, it was the biggest embarrassment ever. Honestly, how Marvin Lewis was still allowed to be employed after that game is beyond my comprehension for years. For years. Yeah. Yeah. And it just says everything you need to know about the ownership. You know, it's, it's, it's, you know, to do another Simpsons reference, it's Superintendent Chalmers is at the school and the guys like, if they hire Skinner back and he'd been fired, I guess. Somebody like you're really gonna hire that guy back and commerce is like, it seems to know the children's names. And that seems to be seems to be the way that Mike Brown, you know, decided to determine who coached the Bengals because because that was that was the ugliest collapse of all time. And so did Marvin Lewis just had no control over the team. So Bengals fans are understandably devastated. That was their last best chance to win a playoff game. And they haven't even sniffed the postseason since the Bengals last playoff win as we already detailed came in 1990 against the Houston Oilers a team which no longer exists. Speaking of Bengals fans, that game also produced the crying crying Bengals lady mean, it was if you've never seen that it was basically a screenshot that from the end of that game, there was a woman in the stands with tears literally streaming down her face with Bengals gear on and that just became a meme for years and years just blew up in one of those big internet themes. You know, 30 credits he has he has a pretty good sense of humor about it she starts a Twitter feed and an Instagram account as like crying Bengals fan or something like that and gains a lot of followers actually appears in some of Pittsburgh dad's episodes of his YouTube channel so kudos to her she kind of took something that was you know, potentially very embarrassing and and kind of turned it into something fun. You know, and honestly, who hasn't been there where you're devastated by your team's loss especially my god if you're a Bengals fan I can't even imagine
Steve 74:38
Yeah, he just dad This is you you should like file for divorce from your team. You're being abused. you're you're you're just being taken advantage of at this point. It isn't fair as ridiculous.
Tim 74:55
The ugliness between these two teams continues for the next couple of seasons. Since it really culminates in the infamous 2017 Monday night game that we talked about in our previous episode that we did about the 2017 season. It's it's I said it, then I'll say it again, it's the sickest I've ever felt watching a sporting event, just three hours of guys taking headshots, and literally trying to severely injure each other. It also results in Ryan's easier being paralyzed and never playing again. I think the only if there's any good takeaway from that atrocity of a football game, it's that essentially kind of marks the end of that era. Perfect, as we, as we said earlier, is is basically forced out of the league A few years later. And the animosity just kind of simmers down over time. So the 2010s you think about that fierce rivalry, you think about all the dirty hits and all the all the hatred between the two clubs during the 2010s, the Steelers and Bengals played 21 times the Bengals only one three of those. That's that's another thing that I would never have guessed. I just I thought it was a little more evenly matched than that. I know. We've mostly got the best of them. But three times in the whole decade, they beat us, Steve, would you have guessed that?
Steve 76:10
No. I thought they would have won more. But I guess in the 2010s you get a finger point. Yeah. It seems like what Dalton they had a better team. They
Tim 76:19
went to the playoffs six times I yeah. How many times have we go to the playoffs? I mean, not more than that. So yeah, I just it was surprising. I didn't realize they only beat us three times at hope that whole time that will decade so
Steve 76:34
that it is three times and we they play us twice a year. So yeah, and
Tim 76:39
the playoff game, so 21 times that they
Steve 76:43
lost a team of 20. Yep. Yes. I mean, if Jerry Porter wouldn't have been there was Joey Porter. Yeah, I think that playoff win is like one that's gonna haunt their franchise for a while. That's gonna be a tough one to shake off. And you know if they ever do, I don't know.
Tim 77:02
Yeah, yeah. So that, that that's kind of the history of the rivalry. Let's talk a little bit about the future. Right now. The Bengals are building once again. They have a young head coach, they have a potentially generational quarterback and Joe burrow. The Steelers future is is kind of uncertain. You know that Ben Roethlisberger is probably playing in his final season this year. So you know what's gonna happen in the 2020s are to say or to say what's quarterback in?
Steve 77:35
Who's the quarterback of the second game for the Bengals last year, the one where the Bengals one. I don't even I don't even know that guy's name. I mean, the seal is played so bad that game.
Tim 77:47
Jeez, yeah. Yeah, some error not gonna work here anymore. Like that was? That's Yeah, that's somebody that that won't be around too much longer.
Steve 77:59
Yeah, Joe burrow was hurt by that point. Right. Yeah, they actually split the series last season. Somehow the Bengals screw Joe burrow up or something? And he's from Ohio too. So yeah, they got the quarterback and they build the rest of the team around them. So
Tim 78:19
yeah, they got the quarterback they have they have really good young receivers. They just drafted that kid this year. I mean, so you know, it's it's it's kind of like the 90s where they had these top picks for a few years and will will pan out or will well not and Time will tell and then the Steelers obviously tons of question marks there right because it's going to be the end of the Ben Roethlisberger era. And what happens after that we saw what we we definitely saw what happened for the many years between the 70s and Ben where's the Steelers didn't have a franchise quarterback and that you know resulted in some success but never a championship so lots of question marks. But you know, though, there'll be plenty of more Steelers Bengals moments, I'm sure in this series that we plenty more stories and characters. They grow out of this rivalry that's pretty much the guarantee. See if any last thoughts on skewers and Bengals?
Steve 79:16
Hopefully, the Bengals lady doesn't have to cry too much more. But hey, you never know.
Tim 79:24
Oh, well, I kinda hope she does have to cry a lot. You're wishing you know nothing against her personally, but her team will lose a lot. Alright, everybody, thank you so much for listening. Please give us a review. Please tell your friends. Check us out on the web or social media. Those links are all in the show description. Catch you next time.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai
Tim 0:01
Hi, everybody. Welcome to the Pittsburgh Sports Memories Podcast. I am your co host, Tim Hannan, and with me as always....
Steve 0:10
Steve Wert. That's me.
Tim 0:12
So, Steve, this week, the Steelers play the Bengals. And I thought it'd be a good time to look back on the history of this rivalry. I think when you think of Steeler rivalries, you know, you think of the Ravens and the Browns and, you know, going back a few years, the Oakland Raiders or even even the Dallas Cowboys, and you don't always put the Bengals at the top of the rivalry list. But they're a team that has always been there for the Steelers. In fact, the Bengals are the only team since the AFL-NFL merger that have been in a division with the Steelers the entire time. So that means that the Steelers and Bengals have played each other more times since the merger. Then either of those teams has played any other team. Pittsburgh leads the series 67 to 36. So what's that, you know, basically, the Steelers have won two out of every three. So the Steelers definitely own the series. But it doesn't mean there haven't been some, you know, close games and definitely some stress it stretches where the rivalry was more evenly matched. And the way that I thought I get through this is to break it up into the five decades that these teams have been playing each other so we kind of go one decade at a time. So before we do that, Steve, you know your your general thoughts on the Bengals rivalry?
Steve 1:50
the Bengals the Bengals franchise or the rivalry with the Steelers both well the Bengals is a franchise haven't had much success unfortunately for Cincinnati and people in Kentucky and maybe that's because they've been in a division with the six time Super Bowl champion Pittsburgh Steelers maybe it's because you know there haven't been run the best over the years. But I think we'll get more into their history to begin with and but it's just the Bengals are just like one of those teams every once in a while they'll jump up and beat the Steelers but fight like you said like nine times out of 10 It seems like when it matters they can they're just one of those teams the Steelers seem to beat I don't ever really remember a big Bengals like where it's like oh heartbreaking Bengals loss. And there's definitely been at least a couple those with the Browns where the Steelers needed to win the game and the Browns were kinda in their way. Least no no less this last year in the playoffs but even before that the Eric Metcalf game and stuff like that.
Tim 3:04
Yeah, there's there's a few times we'll go through, right. There's definitely a few times where the Bengals have gotten the better or the Steelers. But yeah, by and large, it's it's been more and more one sided rivalry. But again, still still, I think a lot of good history and some some memorable moments. So let's, let's start. Like I said we're gonna do this by decade. Let's start in the 1970s. And let's actually start with the year 1970 because that's the year that the AFL and NFL merge. And the Steelers and Bengals who have never played each other before this are both placed in the AFC Central Division where they'll play each other now twice a year. The Bengals were a relatively new team at that point. They've been founded in the 1960s by Paul Brown. He's the same guy who founded the Cleveland Browns.
Steve 3:48
It's kind of like his hate is hate team for the Browns after he got fired by Eric ngmodel he just like to start like well I'm going to show you art modell. I'm gonna start my own franchise in Cincinnati.
Tim 4:01
And it was it was weird to he actually the Bengals have like the exact same uniforms as the Browns for a lot of years that they they eventually change and they go to their strike helmets and everything. But they had these plain orange helmets and an orange and white uniforms. And and they wasn't completely playing like the Browns just said the word Bengals on them. But when they when those if you look at like footage from the 1970s those two teams playing each other It looks like an interesting intrasquad game. Yeah, it does.
Steve 4:32
It does. I just it's just kind of funny how like there's like a whole NFL franchise was just started just because he hated the browns and
Tim 4:41
yes, NFL franchise found that out of spite. Yeah. So in 1970 not only are those two teams put in the newly formed AFC they're also both moving into new stadiums. Three of our stadium in Pittsburgh and Riverfront Stadium in Cincinnati. And what's funny about those teams damiens is they're almost completely identical. There was two other stadiums Veterans Stadium in Philadelphia and fourth Stadium in St. Louis, that were also very similar. And, you know, this was this was during a time when cookie cutter multipurpose stadiums were very popular. They could host football and baseball. And, and this design, it was, you know, whatever this design was, I mean, it's very similar. Steve, if you if you, you know, live in I live in a housing plan. You know, there's probably three other houses in the housing plan that look exactly like yours, the exact same floor plan and aesthetics. And that was kind of a design for stadiums back then. So three rivers and Riverfront. I mean, when you saw them on TV, it was hard to tell. You know, who was playing at home?
Steve 5:46
Well, it's gotten that way with baseball now to I've noticed, like, ever since PNC Park came out. It's like I don't know if they use the same architecture firm or something. But like, they literally have to put name like used to be like when you play the PNC Park, you get Oh, you have that little wall behind them. That's the distinctive look of PNC Park, and even Dodger Stadium you can but boy, now they have to put the names of the ballparks behind the thing or you wouldn't know you know, Wednesday in for another and I don't know the football stadiums really have like baseball stadiums because every football stadiums kind of the same. So I don't know if there's the same kind of aesthetic going on. But yeah, it's great to have the eska loser. I know that's not yet. That's in the news day. Yeah, yeah. Well,
Tim 6:31
we can talk about that when we talk about their their current state. Yeah, the eska. Loser. So say you think of the 70s obviously, is a decade that the Steelers owned. But in the early 70s. The Steeler Steelers are actually still building and the Bengals had a pretty good team. Cincinnati wins the division twice in the early 70s. So so they're they're actually the first team that's, that's good in that division, but it's pretty short lived. The Steelers, of course become one of the greatest teams of all time, and the rest of the decade belongs to them. Now, that doesn't mean that the Bengals totally sucked. They have a quarterback during this era named Ken Anderson, who is a borderline Hall of Famer, a lot of people argue that he should be in the Hall of Fame. He leads the league in passing yards twice. He's even then named the league MVP at one point. He just kind of has the unfortunate position of being in the same division as the 1970s Steelers defense. And and really, you know, one one season that really can just summarize everything. 1976 the Bengals only lose four games all season. But two of them are the Steelers. And as a result, they missed the playoffs.
Steve 7:42
So they went 12 and two, it missed the playoffs or no 10 and four, because there was only 14 games back then. That's right. Yeah, that's all I'm thinking of. Yeah. But but but still, I
Tim 7:52
mean, could you imagine that? You know, the Steelers last last year and the 2020. They they lost four games. And they were the number three seed in the playoffs? Can you imagine losing four games and not even being in the playoffs? And really that was by that was the only had one wild card back then. And so you really it was really important to win your division and because they lost both the games to the Steelers. They didn't win the division.
Steve 8:17
Wow, that's crazy. That will make me hate the Steelers, that's for sure.
Tim 8:22
Yes, for sure. 1976. Also, this season that Paul Brown decides to retire as head coach, but since he still owns the team, he obviously gets the name a successor. And he makes the rather dubious decision to promote his offensive line coach, a guy named Tiger Johnson instead of his offensive coordinator, who was a guy named Bill Walsh. And that decision will come back to haunt them but we'll get to that later.
Steve 8:49
Yeah, whatever happened to that Walsh guy? Yeah, well, we'll find out Tiger Johnson I bet was pretty awesome. Now, since I've never heard of him, or like 30 seconds ago.
Tim 9:01
It'd be pretty cool to have a football coach of the Bengals named Tiger but I mean, that's obviously why Paul Brown there had to be some marketing ploy that he
Steve 9:11
failed Tiger bill ties Well, we're the Bengals and we got to go with Tiger winning for Super free. Yes, he
Tim 9:21
won three. When? Yeah, only threes. He's no Tiger Johnson. One zero. So no, not at all him and saying one zero. Yes, I pretty sure I don't have to look that up to tell you that you're right. So there's three games that I want to just kind of cover from the 70s that are notable. The two teams played each other in the final game of the 1974 season. And the Steelers by that point had already cleansed the division and the Bengals had already been eliminated. So there was really nothing for either team to play for. The Bengals also had some injuries including One Two Anderson. So they had a backup quarterback and and Paul Brown decides to essentially just kill the clock for 60 minutes. The Bengals run the balls literally almost every play and don't do much else. Paul Brown actually only calls three different plays on offense the entire game. So it's basically like a game of technobabble only, like minus one of the plays. I literally don't have Bo Jackson. So right. I mean, literally, that's what he did. He called, he only called three plates. Like, he just kept calling them over and over again. And the one that he calls the most often is just a run up the middle. And he calls that almost every down. So basically, it's just like Run, run, run, punt. They just want to like, end the game and get out of there, I guess. And you would think the Steelers would maybe be okay with this. Because it's the last game of the season, they're about the end of the playoffs, they get to kind of just coast into the playoffs. easy win, but they're actually really ticked off about it. After the game, jack cam, Joe green, a couple of other guys all kind of sound off in the press about how they really wanted a competitive game to get them ready for their playoff game the next week against buffalo. And how they thought it was disrespectful of Cincinnati not to give them that. And this was a different time, you know, because now, you know, the Steelers in recent years, including last season, you know, they've had a number of, you know, the last game of the season means nothing. So they rest all the starters. But back then you didn't you didn't do that. Whether it was preseason, or, you know, the final game of the regular season, you just didn't do that. And so the steers actually are kind of insulted by this. They of course going to win the Super Bowl that year anyway. So, you know, I guess they were still ready for the the bills. But I just thought that was an interesting story about that game that, you know, Paul Brown just basically gave up and the Steelers were mad about it. It's kind of a weird,
Steve 11:58
that's a weird thing to do. But at the same time, like, like, what's the difference between that and like, like you said, What teams do now or they don't start anybody. They just started a bunch of scrubs. And I don't know what what to say like you. Like, don't you owe it to your fans to do something? I mean, where was this guy that with? This is in Pittsburgh, or? Yeah, I think it was in Pittsburgh. So like, basically, you ripped off all the Pittsburgh season ticket holders, which I guess if you're Paul Brown, you don't really care about. I'm, I don't know. Like, I would feel like if it was a home game. I feel like I owe my fans at least something you know, they bought a ticket and came to the game.
Tim 12:42
It's an odd decision for an old school coach like that, too. Because again, this stuff wasn't normal at the time, like you just play like you're, you're getting paid to play you play. And it was just an odd decision. So
Steve 12:53
yeah, and it's so you do feel like you know, they're the fans are the customers and you owe the customers something for their money and you can't completely rip somebody off. But I guess with the US customer. I mean, I guess you could debate to nowadays like would those customers be more happy if you win a meaningless game or the Superbowl? Well, of course, they're gonna be more happy if you win the Superbowl. So it did not didn't Billy could do that. Remember, one year, he didn't arrest anybody. And they ended up losing the next week?
Tim 13:24
Yeah. That was the 2003 final game of the season. And thank God he didn't because that's what allowed us to draft Ben Roethlisberger the next year. If we win that game, then then I think buffalo grass in front of us and they wanted a quarterback and we don't get Ben so well. ravens? Well, we would have got jp lozman. So I mean, would have been all right. Exactly. Another game of note in 1977. The penultimate game of that season for both teams was Steelers add Bengals, and the Bengals came into that game one game behind the Steelers in the division and Anderson throws for over 300 yards against the steel curtain defense and lead Cincinnati to an upset that as he puts the Bengals in first place and in control of their own destiny. All they have to do is be used in the next week, and they win the division. The Steelers are out of the playoffs all together. And again, this isn't middle of the 70s dynasty they were about to knock the Steelers out of the playoffs and win the division. But it doesn't happen the Oilers beat the Bengals 21 to 16 in the last game of the season, that sends the Steelers into the playoffs instead of Cincinnati and the Steelers are so appreciative that they actually take up a collection and buy every Oilers player and coach leather briefcases which Steve is kind of an odd gift for football players. I don't know why they thought leather briefcases would be a nice thank you gift but I mean, it's the thought that counts I guess. I'm trying to who is their quarterback? I
Steve 14:53
forget who the Oilers Dan passerini maybe he really needed like he was I kept losing all his plays. So you Bom Bom Philips is like hey you better get a briefcase to hold them in place. Hey the Steelers brought me one awesome him and Earl Campbell were like this is awesome yeah, I just I mean could you see Earl Campbell with a leather briefcase ever in his life? I mean I know a lot of things a Hall of Fame running back number one but leather briefcase just doesn't seem to fit his style. Yeah, big belt buckle cowboy hat cowboy boots, leather briefcase or something doesn't work here.
Tim 15:37
Yep. So that was kind of a blown opportunity for the Bengals and then 1979 the two teams the game they play at river front going into that game the Bengals are oh and six and the Steelers are five and one and on their way to their four Super Bowl title but the battle is not only upset the Steelers they blow them out three four to 10 when their own six and the Steelers Are you know on their four Super Bowl season so that that's kind of an interesting result there. Can you imagine Steve with Twitter was probably like after that loss. Yeah, I
Steve 16:08
heard Chuck Noll said that Jack Ham and all them yeah, they weren't allowed to be on Twitter that way. They're doing too much tick talking or something you Lynn Swann was just tick talking away on like the Bengals logo before the game and then cause the big stink.
Tim 16:25
I mean, yeah, losing to an O and 60 M I just can't imagine the fan base. Just, you know, fire coke. No. And now this was you today.
Steve 16:34
Well, this is 1979 so Stan Savran might have had his radio radio show sports beat 1979 Stan, what's wrong with Chuck Noll and the Steelers, I'll hang up and listen.
Tim 16:49
So that was that was a definitely a big upset but of course you know, by and large, the 70s belong to the Steelers. So moving into the 80s things things definitely flipped around a little bit in the 80s December 13 1981 is a big game for the for the Bengals Bengal 17 Steelers 10 at Three Rivers Stadium. It's really the Bengals first meaningful win in the series. And it gives the Bengals the AFC Central Division title that year. Anderson completes 21 to 35 for 215 and two, and he later says quote, that's the worst game was one of the most satisfying of my career. It really felt amazing given the ramifications that came from that game and it was the springboard for us going to our first Super Bowl. So you know, Kenny Anderson, who played for the Bengals for many, many years. That was a big, big win for him. And it did propel them to the Super Bowl that here where they lost to
Steve 17:45
fill. And 49 in Kenny Anderson was kind of the king of the what the Dink and dunk pass before it was, you know. I mean, he didn't really keep track of air yards back then. But I have heard that about Ken Anderson.
Tim 17:58
Well, that was that was the West Coast. I mean, that was Bill Walsh the West Coast offense. Right. So I mean, that was Yeah, what a typical,
Steve 18:05
and I guess well, I guess we'll go over that later in the podcast. But Ken Anderson actually plays a big hand in a Super Bowl win for the Steelers later. So
Tim 18:14
yes, yes, he does. 1982 is an interesting game because it's the only season in the last 50 years where these teams only met once. And that was due to the fact that there was a player strike that here and ends up being one of the more memorable fewer Bengals games. We covered this briefly in our episode we did about the att playoffs. The Steelers block a field goal, the Bengals are going to kick the game winning field goal the Steelers blocked field goal to send the game into overtime. And then in overtime, Dwayne Woodruff picks off Kenny Anderson. And so the Steelers get the ball in overtime and then this happens. Is this going over time? So that was a big win for the Steelers because the Bengals were the defending AFC Champions at the time.
Steve 19:21
You know, I'm not I'm not the smartest football like person ever. But you might want to cover a Hall of Famer, you know, I mean, there was nobody within 20 yards or Johnstone, they caught that in the corner of the headset. That I mean, you might want to cover a Hall of Famer there.
Tim 19:39
Yeah, it was it was the Steelers had the ball inside the five and I think the Bengals were completely 100% sold on the fact that Chuck Noll is going to run the ball here because that's what techno always does, and I think they just totally caught them off guard with the past. The funny thing is that so in 100 and Three meetings that these two teams have had only four of those games have gone into overtime and three of them are decided on touchdown passes.
Steve 20:09
I know one of them I know I know tool my guess that one there's another touchdown pass one that decided another one.
Tim 20:17
Yes there's there's so the Steelers won three of them and the three that the Steelers won out of those four are all decided on touchdown passes which you just don't see that much in overtime right you know, in overtime games decided by a field goal. Sometimes a running touchdown or turnover but you know the all three of those score Bengals games that went over time we're one on Steeler touchdown passes. So just a little fun fact there.
Steve 20:40
What was that San Francisco game where garrison hearse ran for like 100 yards, I guess. Yeah.
Tim 20:46
That was against the jets in 98. It was a 98 it was a 98 yard run I think. Yeah. And overtime. Yeah. So the Steelers got the best of the Bengals that day. But really the rest of the decade belongs to Cincinnati. They transition from Ken Anderson and Forrest Gregg was their coach at the time. They transition from those two guys to Boomer Esiason and Sam Weiss. The Steelers Meanwhile, as we detailed in our 80 Steelers episode, flounder for the entire decade, between 1985 and 1990. The Steelers, I'm sorry, the Bengals beat the Steelers nine out of 12 times. So you know, not a lot of memorable games there. But there is one that sticks out for me. It's on October 26 1986. The Steelers beat the Bengals 30 293 or stadium. And that's surprising because the Steelers are one in six going into that game while the Bengals are five and two, and really one of the powerhouses in AFC. But the Steelers not only win, they win by 21 points. And the reason it sticks out for me is because it was the first year game I ever went to. My dad had season tickets in the 70s. And then when my brother and I were born, he gave them to a relative and then I was about nine years old at that point. And he decided to start going back to the games and taking my brother and I and that was the first game that he took me to and I've been going to games with my dad ever since so that's a memorable one for me October 26 1986. And it was a game that you know we just expected to see or still lose by a lot and they win by a lot. So that's pretty cool. It's it's neat. See new actually remember a lot of anything memorable, anything still stick out all these 30 years later, however long that is I can't say I remember much about the actual game. I remember going I remember being there. And I remember you know, the Steelers winning being a shock. I can't say I remember you know who scored touchdowns or anything like that, unfortunately alone through a fast to Weegee Thompson or whoever you know, lips, right, right. Yep. So by and large, you know, this decade was mostly a reverse of the 70s where the Bengals were The Contender and the Steelers were mostly not the contender. The Bengals do you make it to another Super Bowl in 1988 where they lose two.
Steve 23:08
Yeah, that decision isn't haunting them at all. That's two Super Bowls a single Haley was because they pick Tiger Johnson.
Tim 23:15
Yep. Yep. And they lost that one. Of course in heartbreaking fashion. The Joe Montana leads last second drive and so the Bengals he has battles to Super Bowl appearances, but both times the 40 Niners beat them. There there is some animosity between these two teams in the 80s. It's nothing quite like what's about to come. Some years later, but there is some animosity. There's an incident where Keith Gary who's one of the Steelers many first round busts that decade. He literally rips the face mask off of the helmet of Kenny Anderson, which nearly paralyzes Kenny Anderson. Like he twists his neck around and he actually can't feel his legs for a while apparently pretty violent play. A lot of people in Cincinnati were upset about that one. And, you know, deservedly so. And then, you know, Steelers running back Coach daikoku who was with the Steelers for you know, I don't know, 107 years, something like that. He's the one that actually gives Sam wife, the nickname Wicky wacky wife after a wife screws up a game tying feeble attempt against the Steelers in 1987. So what had happened was this the scores are up by three there's only a few seconds left. But the Bengals had the ball in the Steelers 18 yard line and instead of spiking the ball and then running out your field with unit stop the clock I guess Weiss this ran out the field goal unit and time expired before they could ever get a kick off. So the game actually ends with them having the ball in the 18 yard line then or even attempt at the field goal. And after the game decode says quote Wicky wacky wife screws up again. So um, that name that nickname kind of stuck in SAM Weiss, you know, as we've detailed in some of our other episodes. It was was a little unorthodox as a head coach for sure. He didn't have a ton of run ins with Chuck Norris the Steelers, because again, you know, in that era, the Steelers just weren't much competition, you know, not the same as what he had with teams like the Oilers and brown. So that's the
Steve 25:19
I never thought like Sam Weiss was that bad of a coach? I don't know. I remember him having that. That name, but I was thought that's because he like called, like crazy play calls. Like he would just like, you know, I don't know, 1315 let's run the ball or something, you know, something weird like that.
Tim 25:36
Yeah. And he would, he would do stuff that was kind of, like not breaking the rules, but kind of kind of Bella check in, where he he'd figure out ways to manipulate the roles, like he, they had to make that rule about if you're allowed to, like, once your offensive guys are in the huddle, they have to stay in the huddle, because he would wait for them to you know, he, you'd have like three running backs in the huddle when he wait for the defense to put in, like all their, you know, goal line set. And then he'd like run out the running backs and put in like three receivers, you know, just like stuff like that, and, you know, stuff where they never had to have a role before that. But then they did. Now, like I said, kind of kind of Bella check in before Bella check. So
Steve 26:15
they do that in college, though, like I don't know, like, now they change your will to like, cuz they used to, like I remember, Pitt would always get mystified by this, like, and I remember North Carolina doing it a lot. And some other teams did it. Like, if there's like, you're coming out of like a TV timeout, like, you know, sometimes those are won. Like, they'll just huddle right on the sideline. And if you huddle on the sideline, you can have all 50 players standing there. So you don't really know who's coming out on offense. And they would just run right out to the line of scrimmage. So you would be stuck with whatever defense was out there. And so I don't know, like I noticed, like, like you said, like, I know they had to make that rule. But also there's ways around it like you'll see times where like, the quarterback, I'll stand off like five or 10 yards away while they're changing players, you know. So like, you can still substitute guys, you know, in and out as long as you aren't in the huddle, technically, I guess. But I guess we all think Sam Weiss for all that silliness.
Tim 27:18
He would have been proud. Yeah. So let's move on to the 1990s. And in the 90s, things flipped again. And boy do they flip big this time. Paul Brown dies in 1991 and his son might take over as owner and general manager and he flat out sucks it both jobs. those are those are those are two jobs he holds To this day, by the way. Some fun stats for the Bengals and or Mike Browns leadership for the last 30 years. They're the only team with three nine game or nine game or more losing streaks. During his time as owner, there's been 25 NFL teams that have started season o and six, and the Bengals are stiff six of those teams. They also have four of the 13 Oh, and eight starts during that time. So 13 or I'm sorry, 1/3 of the oh and eight starts. During that time. I've been Bengal teams. They've gone winless in October nine different times. And probably most significantly, they have zero postseason victories. Mike Brown is the equivalent of Bob Nutting Jr. He's an owner that just does the absolute minimum to invest in his team doesn't understand how to run a team doesn't understand when to bring in new coaches and when to fire people when to draft the appropriate talent. I mean, he just he's not good at being an owner or general manager. You definitely should not have both jobs. That's for sure.
Steve 28:50
I i when's the last playoff games isn't anyone I remember. I think we said that in one of the pot. Other podcasts? I can't remember.
Tim 28:57
It was 1990. They beat the Oilers. I know they'd be lawyers. Okay. And the next week they lost to the Raiders in the game that Bo Jackson are that's what I'm thinking. Okay. Wow. Yeah. They have not won a playoff game since 1990. Right since since Bo Jackson was in the league. So that's how long ago that was.
Steve 29:17
You realize there are people out there like 30 years old that have never seen a Bengals playoff win? Yes, that's correct. That's correct. You answered that like oh, like you're on the witness stand? Yes, Your Honor.
It's a holy cow. The math checks out. That's it. That is as bad as the fire. Wow.
Tim 29:42
Yeah, exactly. Cincinnati is the worst NFL team of the 1990s. They lose 108 games during that decade. And I think Steve I I couldn't fact check this but I believe this is around the time that my raincoat starts calling them the Bumbles. That's a book calls here. Let's say and we talked in our last episode about how Myron Koch came up with all this stuff that would just stick for years. I that's one that always stuck him calling them the bungles. I mean to this day that
Steve 30:10
they people still call them that in non Steeler fan like, it doesn't even have like ESPN announcers or bunco. Right? Right.
Tim 30:19
Steelers, meanwhile, are reborn under new head coach Bill Cowher, and they're one of the more successful teams of the decade. So during the 1990s, the Steelers mostly on this series, but again, that doesn't mean it's it's not competitive. Some memorable games from that era in 1992. The Bengals drafted this quarterback out of Houston named David Klingler. He was the number six overall pick, super highly touted coming out of college. I think he had a game in college where he threw for literally like 700 yards. And so I mean, you know, this was going to be the next great quarterback, his first ever start. That season is against the Steelers, and they sack David Klingler 10 times. And that's, I mean, that's more or less the end of David clinger like he never amounted to much in the NFL, much like every other Cincinnati pick that decade. And they had so many high draft picks.
Steve 31:12
I think that's the scariest part of is like, like, well, they may say that, uh, Kelly Smith like that, that was one of the and kajaani I mean, I can't blame them that cuz that guy was really good. He went to Penn State. I can blame my buddy, but he was really good in college. He was for Penn State. akili Smith, wasn't that good. And don't draft
Tim 31:34
don't draft Penn State running back. That's that's a lesser name, Franco. Well, yeah. And Larry Johnson had a pretty good career. But other than that, don't say running
Steve 31:46
for the Giants might be all right.
Tim 31:48
Yeah, if he doesn't get hurt every year, but we digress. 1995 there's a Thursday night game at three of our stadium. We talked about this in our 95 Steelers episode. Steve and I were at this game. It's very, very miserable memory for both of us. Jeff Blake this the Bengals had moved on to a quarterback named Jeff Flake at this point, and definitely was never a star quarterback. But two things yeah, he always be through a really pretty deep ball and he always seemed to kill the Steelers. And that game, boy did he kill us. I mean, he just was throwing these rainbows to darnay Scott and Carl Pickens who were there two receivers. In the Steelers at that time it rod Woodson and gotten hurt. They had a very patchwork secondary and definitely just destroyed them. Later that year, there's a rematch at river front. And that's another really memorable game because once again the Bengals comes out to a huge lead. But this time the Steelers actually come all the way back and score a bunch of points in the second half. And probably the most memorable play from that game happens late in the second half. And I'm gonna play the clip of it. It's interesting clip because the announcers for NBC are Deke Enberg, Paul McGuire and Phil sands. And Paul McGuire and Phil Simms literally predict this play before it happens and then openly route for kordell Stewart it's a past it's long past kordell Stewart from the Ella Donal. They actively like root for him to score during this play.
Unknown Speaker 33:30
Deck I promise you, Phil and I have already agreed to promises they're going to throw the ball down the middle one time to kordell Stewart because this guy looks like a racehorse. There's nobody near him. You know what it is? He's getting the slow there's all three receivers since the defense is playing solo so nobody can account for what is right down the middle of the field. This was in rubber river fried, right? Yes. Oh, there were a lot of Steeler fans. Yeah, that's
Steve 34:12
there was a loud roar when that happened. Yeah, that wasn't just phil simms and Paul McGuire that was cheering to Yeah, you remember them. I remember watching that game on TV. And I remember them calling that too. I remember them saying Oh, he's gonna score he's running down the middle of wide open.
Tim 34:30
Yeah, I mean, and that kind of just epitomized the Bengals of that era when they're setting up their you know, able to break the play because the battles defense was so bad. So yeah, that was that was a memorable game and a memorable play that kind of, yeah, help launch kordell Stewart into that slash role that everybody kind of remembers him fondly as a couple years later, there's a game again Riverfront in 1998. And this time Neela I know who threw that past kordell Stewart he's on the Bengals. And in starting for the Bengals, he leads a 93 yard last minute touchdown drive to beat the Steelers. And Carl Pickens, we mentioned him before the receiver. Talk about a guy that just destroyed the Steelers. He burns Dwayne Washington twice on that final drive. Once for 50 yards on a fourth down play 50 yard game. And then again on a game winning touchdown throw from Neil which came out of all things, a fake spike play. Pickens finishes that game with over 200 yards receiving and he was very good against the Steelers and Dwayne Washington was not very good for the Steelers.
Steve 35:41
Yeah, I remember why I think we watch this game over your house. And it was I just remember like, being so annoyed because it was Neil O'Donnell Neela dollar like, Oh my gosh, of all the quarterbacks in the world. Why Why you? Why do you like wander into against us and like, Dwayne Washington just couldn't cover like a jump past. Like, it wasn't like Carl Pickens was just running by him. It was just like these jump balls and like Dwayne Washington was the worst at covering a jump ball. It was it was bad.
Tim 36:12
Yeah, that was kind of Dwayne's, you know, career. Yeah. You know, he, like you said he'd never that's why he lasted so long. Because he wasn't he didn't get burned. If you asked him he would be on a guy. But he just had no like spatial awareness. Like he he could be there, he'd be on a guy, but then the guy would still catch it, for whatever reason. And that was just the story of Dwayne's life, unfortunately. Yeah. So that's the 90s. Again, Bengals were just beyond miserable in that decade and the Steelers were pretty good. So moving into the 2000s, some news, some new stuff for the new millennium. First off, you know, new stadiums for both teams. So Paul Brown stadium opens in 2000, complete with the ESCO loser. As Steve referred to earlier, they have this huge escalator that carries people kind of in and out of the upper stands. And you know, ESPN because the Bengals were still bad in that era. used to just always write any, anytime they would run the NFL primetime highlights, they would just always kind of end it with people filing out down the escalator like midway through the fourth quarter. So nice stadium but famous for the big escalator and then the year after that, Heinz Field opens in Pittsburgh in 2001, the first home game at Heinz Field, in Heinz rotisseries se against the Bengals. So new stadiums, but you know, at least at first it seems to be more of the same Steelers good, Bengals bad in 2001. There's an interesting game late in the season at Cincinnati, where the Bengals went in overtime. We talked about the four overtime games and see Where's one three, this is the one that the Bengals won. It's only the third loss for the Steelers that season and it doesn't really matter doesn't really impact their their record. The Steelers were very good that year, and they were still the number one seed in the AFC playoffs, even with that loss. But what's interesting about that game is this the reason the Steelers were dominating the league that year is because they had built this really stealth defense, and no one else could solve it. But the one guy who figures out how to beat it is Cincinnati's head coach, a guy named Dick lebeau, who you might recognize as having coached the Steelers defense in four different Super Bowls. He has the offense run out of a spread formation and Jon kitna, his quarterback attempts 68 passes and completes a lot of those for foreign during 11 yards and the Bengals when it's an unorthodox strategy to pass 68 times and run out of a spread formation, but it beats the Steelers and that I think carries over into the next season. The first two games of the 2000 Tuesdays and as we talked about in our Tommy Maddox episode, were against the Patriots and the Raiders. And they copied that strategy and they destroyed the Steelers defense and then everybody else was kind of onto it by then. And the 2002 defense became all of a sudden very easy to pass against. And that was kind of the end of that mini era for the Steelers.
Steve 39:16
Yeah, I don't know. I don't know who their offensive coordinator was. It might have been Bruce caused it or somebody like that. We ended up being I think he ended up being a head coach for them for a couple years. But yeah, somebody somebody figured it out. And then nobody figured it out till later that year. Charlie Weis and Bill Belichick figured it out. But
Tim 39:36
Right. Right. So things really start to change in 2003. Both teams are moved to the new AFC North division by that point in the Bengals hire a new new head coach named Marvin Lewis. Marvin Lewis is from Pittsburgh. From Fort Cherry, I think and was an assistant coach was yours in the 90s. So He's a guy that has a lot of Pittsburgh history. He's hired to say go to the Bengals the Bengals also that you're drafted quarterback from USC named Carson Palmer. Coincidentally in the same draft the Steelers select homers roommate, a guy named for Polamalu. The next year the Steelers draft the quarterback of their own kid named Ben Roethlisberger, from Miami of Ohio. And by 2005, both teams are really good. They both have these young stud quarterbacks, and for the first time and, you know, really decades, there's actually a lot at stake when these two teams meet. So the team that the Bengals are building is is pretty talented, but is incredibly unlikable. I mean, they just they thought their team was a bunch of guys who were either like criminals or just flat out jerks. They actually had nine different players arrested. In the same season nine out of a 53 man roster were spent time in jail. Chris Henry was one of those guys. When Henry was at WVU. Rich Rodriguez, the head coach at West Virginia stated that Henry was, quote, an embarrassment to himself and as a program. I mean, Steve, deep, can you imagine how hard you'd have to work to be called an embarrassment to the WVU football program? Like this is none other than rich Rodriguez. Yeah. I mean, this is a
Steve 40:06
Yeah. I mean this program is like questioning your loyalty that guy's really not loyal. I that's crazy. I'm Wow. I never had heard that quote before, but that's a good one. Yeah, I that I guess they just kind of fell into that trap and the Bengals aren't the only team that fall into this. I think the Steelers have fallen prey to this at times. They just see the talent and think, well, we can reform this guy or once he gets here we'll be strict and we can get him to change his ways and sometimes that works out but I think for my experience, most times it just is more heartache than it's worth.
Tim 40:49
For sure every team has fallen into that trap. I just the Bengals during that arrow seemed to stack guys that had that. That had that in the in their track record. Yeah, aside from the guys getting arrested, it's sad. Johnson was one of the more outspoken players on that team, aka Ocho Cinco. He was very cocky. Very, you know, look at me, kind of player who a lot of Steelers fans a lot of people in the NFL disliked a TJ who Simmons auto was our other receiver. he famously wiped his feet with terrible towel. Here's another guy that was very cocky. My favorite TJ Houshmandzadeh story that he told me years later, was that he was talking Troy Polamalu. He said something to him and swore out and then was pressed off game and Troy turned around and said, God bless you, TJ and TJ Houshmandzadeh two years later said, I felt so bad and I never said anything negative to him again.
Steve 41:49
One way to stop the trash talk.
Tim 41:52
Kill them with kindness. That's Troy for you. So even even TJ who from his auto who is you know, a class one kind of jerk? You know, he even felt bad about trash talking Troy so 2005 the Steelers win the game at Cincinnati, but as we detailed in our 2005 trilogy episodes, the Bengals win a late season game at Heinz Field and they win the AFC North, the Steelers have to win their final four games of the season just to squeeze into the playoffs as the number six seed and that sets up a wildcard playoff matchup at Paul Brown stadium. And you know, I think we all remember what happens in that game. On the first drive of the game. Carson Palmer drops back to pass Kimo von Oelhoffen rolls into his leg. And that's the end of carson palmer just totally shredded his knee and he's knocked out of the game and as to go through months and months of rehab. And so the narrative for that game, of course, you know, is all about how chemo was a former Bengal, by the way, injured Palmer on purpose and the cheating Steelers won the game Thanks to that, you know they really didn't deserve it. So that's that's kind of the narrative rarely mentioned is the fact that the backup quarterback in Cincinnati was Jon kitna, who had been their starter before Palmer got there and it was a pretty good solid veteran. And also rarely mentioned is the fact that kitna leads the Bengals to 17 first half points. I mean, if you score 17 points in a playoff game in the first half, you should be in pretty good shape. Right? But not not, not those Bengals, they reportedly get into a locker room fight at halftime, allegedly Chad Johnson and Hugh Jackson another you know, another winner, Hugh Jackson, are in the middle of that one. And keep in mind that this is at halftime when the Bengals are in the lead. So just you know, their immaturity and their inability to handle any kind of adversity whatsoever. This caused them to collapse. They surrender 17 unanswered points to the Steelers in the second half. And they're eliminated. And, you know, I don't want to underscore this too much. I mean, losing Palmer was big. It certainly was and that's a hard way to, you know, to, especially on the like the third play of the game, right. But, you know, what, couple of years ago the Eagles drafted a quarterback named Carson Wentz to replace a guy named Nick Foles. And they were having a really good season. And you know what happened when Scott hurt? And he was out for the whole season. And you know what the Eagles did? They didn't collapse in full they put Nick Foles back in. And Nick Foles won the Super Bowl against Tom Brady. So I'm just saying that you don't always have to roll over and die because you have faced a little bit of adversity. But but that's that was that was that team and the thing Steve I really hated about that team was I always thought they were fraught. You know, they they thought that because they had one good season. They were like entitled to some kind of championship caliber status. And they like they hadn't even played the call to the Patriots or any of the other superpowers in AFC. But But to this day, even they still insisted headlines. often not intentionally hurt Palmer that they would have won the Super Bowl that year.
Steve 45:06
Yeah, that's just the Bengals for you. That's that air of Bengals at least and I don't I don't understand that kind of attitude because like you said they never even played like the Patriots are the Colts nevermind beating them and plus a fun fact that chemo remembering chemo came to the Steelers Do you know how the Steelers got him? Do
Tim 45:29
you remember that? Dermontti Dawson. Yeah,
Steve 45:31
Dermontti Dawson couldn't block them and when your Hall of Fame center says hey, that guy's pretty good. There's there's like Alright, we'll go and get them.
Tim 45:38
Yep, so yeah, I just yeah, that was the Bengals You're right. And and because of that, that that's for that win has to be in in my top five most satisfying wins. Period any sport in my life as a Pittsburgh sports fan. You know, and then just to hear them whine about it. Carson Palmer, the Sports Illustrated did this big cover story about his rehab over the offseason. All he talked about was just how much he hates the Steelers. And it's like, Okay, fine. obsess about us. You know, we were off winning the Super Bowl. You were sitting there obsessing about us.
Steve 46:16
He cried about it too. Like I remember like, Oh, they should have never beat the Colts and they should never beat the Broncos and what they do beating the Seahawks. It's like, Get over yourself. Like you would have been able to do that.
Tim 46:27
Yeah, he's he was he acted like a fan on Twitter. Right? Like, you deserve detail. It's like your starting quarterback for the team. Like you worry about next season. Again. It's just a bunch of babies. It was it was so so satisfying. You know, it's not like beating Baltimore like it beating Baltimore. You know, there's there's been so many huge wins against the Ravens. But But Baltimore's a well run franchise with good players and when you beat them, your B it's it's feels good because you're beating a big rival who's a really big challenge. The Bengals were frauds, and it was so fun to just expose them as the frauds that they were. I have a clip here. And it's it's in a clip you'll hear two things go here. Joey Porter on the sidelines is kind of the second we're taking away and the fans were starting to fall out of the stadium. So it's really Porter taunting the fans. And then the second half of the clip is going to be bill cower in the locker room after that game mocking the Bengals who de chant
I love that. That was great cower just totally totally mocking that's the Bengals if you don't know that's their big I don't know if Steve What do you call it talent or key or whatever?
Steve 48:04
I guess yeah, I always thought that was a but what New Orleans is gn but I guess it's Cincinnati. I don't know. Maybe there's a large Cajun population in Cincinnati. They come off the Mississippi River that far. I don't
Tim 48:18
whatever. Who cares. It's stupid. Did they stop
Steve 48:20
at Cincinnati? Why don't they just keep coming up? Because
Tim 48:25
it was it was just it was so funny. Here. cower, mock them. One last footnote from that game. Joey Porter. This is what he said about that game shortly afterwards. He said, quote, I didn't care if Palmer was heard or not. So I was the bad guy. Once again. I laughed at their sorrows. Ha ha ha. And just keep that in mind. Oh, Jerry Porter. Just keep that in mind because Porter would once again factor into a Steelers Bengals huge game many years after his career and that's kind of the end of that era for the Bengals too. There is one more very satisfying victory the next season. So in 2006 the Steelers don't have a very good season as defending Super Bowl champions and their way eliminated from the playoffs in the last game of the season. They're playing in Cincinnati was a chance to eliminate the Bengals from the playoffs and build cars click before this game was something like misery loves company. So the Steelers had nothing to play for but they they could knock the Bengals out of the playoffs. And that game actually goes into overtime
Steve 49:34
and saying they called more than the same three running plays.
Tim 49:37
Yeah. Yes, they did. Yeah, no coward did not run the ball in the middle. In fact, in overtime, they did this. Back shirt drop quick slant on his way up the left sideline. He is going he is going he's just down Nice. So that's that was the end of the Bengal season that year thanks to San Antonio Holmes in the Steelers, and that's actually both our final ever game is head coach. And so his final ever play as head coach is a 67 yard touchdown reception by Holmes in overtime to eliminate the balance from the playoffs and I can't think of a more fitting way for Coach Gower to go out and that
Steve 50:26
that's that is a quite awesome way to go out for a coach cower. I wish I wish he could have made the playoffs one last time maybe ended on the Super Bowl but a good for good for Bill and you know I can't see why the Bengals fans don't like the Steelers at all. I mean
Tim 50:42
Oh wait, you haven't seen anything yet.
Steve 50:44
Could you imagine being like a Bengals fan? That's like 60 or 70 years old. You've had to live through all this? I yeah, there's no way you're still fan at the like you've given up on the Bengals or maybe you're like, like it's like pit football where you give up on them for a while and then they get good and you go back in again and say oh, why am I a fan? This is like very like pit football ask. Like just the pain just never stops with the bagels.
Tim 51:11
Yeah, pretty. Pretty much. Speaking of the pain with the Bengals by 2008. When the Steelers are on their way to a second Super Bowl victory, the Bengals start that season oh and eight. And there's a game on October 19 of that season where the Steelers blow out the Bengals in Cincinnati. That game is notable because Hines Ward breaks the jaw of Bengals linebacker Keith rivers on and just an absolutely vicious block. Rivers was the Bengals first round pick that year and that that hit actually ends his season. And the NFL so constitutes a roll after that. called the Hines Ward roll where I guess you're not allowed to hit people too hard or something like that.
Steve 51:51
You're not allowed to block a guy. It's like a blindside block. Like while going towards the goal line or something like that. You have to come from the side or something stupid. It was literally blocking too hard. He I think he did get a paddle. I think I did Heinz or get a penalty.
Tim 52:08
I know. He didn't, because it was legal at the time. But then, you know, the NFL had to step in and player safety blah, blah, blah. So but that was that was memorable. I was I was at that game. Steve. My. My dad's birthday is on October and my brother and I for his birthday here. We got tickets and did a road trip to Cincinnati. And I have to say, you know, Cincinnati fans say what you want. They were definitely very friendly to us that day. I remember one guy ran up to us. We're all wearing our car gear. One guy ran up to us and started yelling something about you know, how's the students something negative about the Steelers? And he just kind of pauses like no, not really, we suck. In walking out of the stadium, there were these two guys that had bags over their head. They were holding up this giant sign that said fire Mike Brown. I had my camera with me. I was taking pictures and I snapped a picture of these two guys. And only like months later, I was looking at my pictures. And I noticed that when I snapped the pictures one of the two guys flipped me off.
Steve 53:15
I do blame them. I know.
Tim 53:18
Hilarious. I thought I thought it was so funny. I didn't I didn't I didn't even realize it at the time until I looked at the picture. But it was a I was I'll put I'll post that picture on our website because it was it was really funny. Also of note in 2008 Steve, you mentioned this earlier, Kenny Anderson finally gets a Super Bowl ring. Ironically as the quarterback coach of the Steelers, so after all those years in the 70s of not being able to win a Super Bowl. You know thanks in large parts of the Steelers. Kenny Anderson gets a Super Bowl ring with the seal are so good on Kenny Anderson there Yeah, yeah, it's kind of weird that there's like that thick lebeau connection and then Kenny Anderson connection so there's some weird like Bengals Steeler connections for whatever reason I don't know maybe it's just farming Lewis to cuz he was on Yeah, staff for I think I'm pretty sure he was on that 95 staff that went to the Super Bowl. So he was on our staff for a while too.
Steve 54:18
Yeah, it's definitely a weird thing like that. So I don't know what to make of it. Maybe the NFL is just like that. They hire a lot of assistants from other teams and stuff. So
Tim 54:29
yeah, yep. So let's go into the 2000 10s and the 2000 10s of Bengals done with the arts, with the arts. And in the 10s the Bengals have a resurgence. They have a new group of stars including the red rifle himself. Andy Dalton quarterback and they actually make the playoffs six times between 2009 and 2015. Steve Did you remember that they made the playoffs six times.
Steve 54:57
I do remember them being kind of new. mediocre and this guy which is sad because it's probably like the golden age of Cincinnati Bengals football and like they're pretty mediocre. Everyone's like why oh, they're gonna be good. It's like, I don't know. They're just kind of okay. It's like, I don't know. Like and then same thing with the Andy Dalton Andy Dalton isn't a bad quarterback, but like God wouldn't put him in even the same league as like a trend. Well, he's better than Trent Dilfer, but I'm trying to think like somebody like that's just kind of like a Nick foles would Yeah, I don't
Tim 55:32
I maybe like Kirk Cousins about like somebody like
Steve 55:35
yeah, it's like he gets lots of a lot of stats, but he never really seems to win the even the big regular season games. Nevermind a big playoff game. So I don't know at least Nick foles has that going for me seems see Nick foles is like the opposite. He seems like he saves all his wins for the playoffs. In the playoffs. He's like Superman.
Tim 55:57
I just would not have guessed six playoff appearances between oh nine and 15 I just I just would I remember them you know, like he said being you know, decent, but six playoff variants. I just wouldn't have guessed that but
Steve 56:09
didn't them and it seemed like them in Houston played every every wildcard weekend. It was like oh, it Cincinnati in Houston again, it's like okay, and like neither those teams were gonna contend for the Superbowl. Yeah, it was just like, okay, it's just like the opening preview of like before patriots play somebody that the second best team in the AFC
Tim 56:29
that year? Yes. It was like there's like the playing game for the NCAA Tournament.
Steve 56:35
Even Davidson and you know,
Tim 56:39
Central Kentucky tech or whatever. Yeah. The Steelers have a couple of down seasons, but by 2014. They're contenders again. And that season 2014. The Steelers and Bengals play on the final week of the season at Heinz Field. They decided to division, both teams that already clinched a playoff spot, but that game was for the division. And that's that's one of the really great games that probably won't be always remembered. But it was a super competitive game. A lot of big plays Antonio Brown, absolutely dominates that game. He has a 71 yard punt return, touchdown and a 63 yard touchdown reception dice the game late. It's a great game, but unfortunately it ends up working out badly for both teams. The Steelers lose levy on bell to an injury and the Bengals lose AJ green their star receiver. And you know both teams, the Steelers and the Bengals lose their subsequent playoff games the next week, largely due to missing their their offensive stars. So the rivalry is back at this point. And it's really starting to turn ugly. There's a bunch of incidents This is a not totally complete list but here's here's some of the things that were notable Pittsburgh linebacker Terrence Garvin number Terrence Garvin, Steve. No, no no yeah. Anyway, Pittsburgh linebacker Terrence Garvin breaks the jaw and neck of Cincinnati's punter on a hit and draws a $25,000 fine from the league. I think that was on a Antonio brown punt return and Garvin just levels the Cincinnati pattern breaks his neck. So a lot of people insist that hey, we're upset about that one. Mike Tomlin and Daniel safety writing Nelson get into it after a game. Tomlin was upset about a late hit. I think that was actually the game that I just referenced for Belle got hurt. And the guy that hit him was Nelson and Tomlin felt like that was not a clean hit. And they got into it after the game. Mike muntjac Hall of Fame offensive line coach also gets into into it with Nelson in a different game. And this one was not after the game is actually during a game and draws a personal foul penalty. So you know, pretty interesting note on my tax career that he incurred a personal foul call 20 years after his retirement.
Steve 59:01
Whenever I remember that Mike munchak they like Didn't he like grab his head
Tim 59:05
grab this. He grabbed his hair because Reggie Nelson had like dreadlocks sticking out of his helmet. And I think Nelson kind of ran into him and Munch I took such into it. Yeah, his hair. And I got your flag. But that was just kind of fun.
Steve 59:18
Like manchac was the standard like you know, sometimes they stand like right at the edge of this. Like he was like well into the bench too, if I remember correctly,
Tim 59:26
but yeah, Nelson probably did it on purpose. I'm just gonna assume that well, one guy you know right raging Nelson had some run ins with Steeler coaches but the guy that was really at Ground Zero and all this likeliness there's a guy named vontaze burfict Bengals linebacker. He knocks living on bail out for the season in 2015. And then celebrates the hit after the play. A lot of the Steelers players were really pissed off about that one Ramon foster says quote, that's what type of guy he is, and he'll get his Perfect and Vince Williams and Dame terrorists and get into a pregame skirmish before 2015 game. Steve James Harrison's other guy that kind of crossover between teams. He spent that year with the Bengals remember? Perfect kicks Roosevelt next during a game and he also gets fined for dirty hits on Antonio brown and James Conner and another game. So Vaughn says perfect was was definitely public enemy number one for the Steelers and their fans. Pretty much the whole time he played in Cincinnati.
Steve 60:30
He just didn't it wasn't just the Steelers to like I remember there was a game with Cam Newton and Carolina like remember that he was like twisting his like foot after like, like his ankle and stuff after the play was over. In like in the league, just let that go on and on and on. Like a Steeler play like Harrison was with the Steelers would like just sneeze on somebody. And the league would be like, $10,000 fine, we'll have perfect like, at some point, don't you need to go to go to like the soccer role where like, you've accumulated so many, you know, fat personal files, like in soccer, you get so many yellow cards, they start to suspend you from games. And that's, that's what I always felt like, if you're if you're really serious about player safety, and blah, blah, blah, and whatever, this isn't just willing window dressing, then you need to come up with a rule. Like if you get so many personal fouls, you're suspended for a game. And then you know so many and then you get so many more your expanded for six games, and then it's a year and then it's a playoffs or, or even better just suspend somebody for the playoffs. You know, if your team makes the playoffs or whatever team you go to, if that team makes the playoffs, you're not at the play in the first playoff game whenever that is and see that that'll put it and the guys like him and the way they're gonna clean up their act are a team team can't afford to pay a guy like that to not play in the playoffs.
Tim 61:56
So so they eventually the NFL eventually does do that. It's it's not until years later, it's when burfict is playing for the Raiders. He hits a guy in the head for the Colts and they suspend them for an entire rest of the season. It was in like week four or something.
Steve 62:11
Yeah, they finally did something about it, but it was too little too late. I it just they they should just come up with a policy just just a road policy. You know, you get so many personal fouls, you're out for one game and then if you come back and you get you know one or two more you're out for six games you know just in then you're all for playoff games, and that'll that'll be the guys either gonna like just adjust his play or he's gonna be out of the league and either one is fine with me and I would say if it was a steal or whatever.
Tim 62:42
Yeah, I agree you know making its objective and making it you know, NFL discipline when they feel like finally disciplining it that's way too subjective. And, and like you said, because of that he was allowed to you have caused a lot of chaos for a lot of years.
Steve 62:57
And it wasn't just what the Steelers they want it really wasn't it really wasn't. It was like I said there was a it just like, like I said, it wasn't like oh, like some time or one time Harrison hit a wide receiver from Cleveland. It was kind of questionable that maybe didn't hit him in the shoulder, maybe in the shoulder slid into his head. No, like, Cam Newton was literally laying on the ground and he's sitting there twisting his ankle. Like, that's not part of any part of football. He wasn't advancing the ball. He's laying on the ground. He's already down. That's literally intent to injure. I don't understand why. I don't understand why he was so why the league was so lenient towards him and not other people. So
Tim 63:40
yep, totally agree.
Steve 63:43
Yeah, it wasn't like he played for New York or some I don't know. And that's enough about perfect.
Tim 63:48
Yeah, I mean, you're I mean, you're spot on. You're absolutely right. It's there was no reason why he should have been allowed to, to cause chaos for as long as he caused chaos for so the Steelers Bengals quickly kind of becomes a cringe worthy affair. Whenever they play each other. In 2015. The Bengals put together one of the best seasons that they've ever had, they go 12 and four, and they win the division and the only other times that the Bengals won that many games. They made it to the Super Bowl both times. So that was that was a banner year for the Bengals going 12 and for the Steelers that year squeezed into the playoffs with some help on the last week of the season from the Buffalo Bills. And that sets up a second Steelers Bengals playoff game almost 10 years to the day after the first one and oh my Is it the mother of all Steeler Bengals games. Again, the game is in Cincinnati just like it was a decade earlier and again. The Bengals have a problem at quarterback Andy Dalton had been injured before the game It wasn't the Steelers fault this time.
Steve 64:51
A key move on often was well retired.
Tim 64:56
They have to start AJ McCarran at quarterback. And that definitely hurts their offense. The Steelers build a 15 to nothing lead into the fourth quarter. But burfict hits Ben with yet another team shot and then has to be carted off the field. Classy, Bengals fans as Ben's been carted off the field, held him with beer cans. And here as he's being carted off the field was very severe so they thought he was thirsty. Uh huh. Yeah, I'm sure that was it. So without Ben Roethlisberger the Bengals are able to mount a huge comeback. McCarran hits AJ green for go ahead touchdown with two minutes left. Landry Jones is in the game for the Steelers playing like Landry Jones, he you know he comes in to try to lead a last second drive and he throws what is presumably a game ending interception to have all people found that's perfect. Did Mr. cheap shot artists? Yeah. And it's just it's I the feeling at that moment was so low Steve because here the Steelers are gonna lose a playoff game because perfect took out. It was the season that perfect to take it out. levy on bill. So we didn't have levy on Bell because perfect took him out. And then he takes out Ben, and then he's going to get the game ending interception. I mean, it just it wasn't right. Like wasn't justice.
Steve 66:20
Well, until it's like this after the NFL like member cracked out on the Steelers for hitting people too hard. But now the Bengals are allowed to do it. Yeah, it's Yeah,
Tim 66:29
it you know, it was a terrible feeling. Well, what happens next will be talked about for I think generations because it's still to this day, I can't believe it happened. So the Bengals are trying to kill the clock at this point. They're doing they run the ball with Jeremy Hill. They're running back. He stripped by Ryan saisir and the Steelers get the ball back. I mean, I think you know, if not for what happened next. That would be remembered as one of the biggest errors of all time because at that point in the game. You're just holding on to the ball. You're just trying not to fumble. You're already in field arrange. That's all you have to do. Just don't fumble and Jeremy Hill fumbles. Ben then limps back out onto the field. I guess they figured that Ben Roethlisberger with, you know, 10% of his shoulder was better than Landry Jones with 100% of his shoulder. You know, and that was pretty amazing. Because remember, he was he wasn't that he got just got hurt. He was carted off the field. But he lives back on there, he attempts to lead the Steelers on the last second drive. And he does make a few plays including a fourth down conversion. But he can't. It's pretty obvious he can't throw the ball more than five or six yards. So they're just trying to like think their way down the field, five or six yards at a time. And that's not really working because they get the ball to bounce midfield. There's 20 seconds left, but they're out of timeouts at this point. So that means they have to throw towards the sidelines, they have to at least take a shot somewhat deep. It's also raining. Which means that Yeah, the Steelers can't exactly attempt a 40 or 50 yard field goal because the weather's ugly. So still, even with the Jeremy Hill fumble the odds of the Steelers pulling us off are slim to none at this point. Roethlisberger attempts to pass over the middle of brown. It's incomplete. But he's hit in the head by who else vontaze burfict draws a 15 yard personal foul penalty. Brown is concussed on the play. He's lying on the field and being attended to one of the guys out there helping him off the field is Joey Porter, who is now an assistant coach for the Steelers and
Steve 68:46
Jerry Porter.
Tim 68:49
Whether whether or not porters allowed to be out there is kind of up for debate. But regardless, he's out there and he and PacMan Jones start joking with each other because Porter was the bad guy again haha. And Jones inexplicably tries to throw a punch at Porter from like a mile away. Like he wasn't even close to him and he tries to just take a swing at them. It's an official in the back of the head instead. And he gets flagged for a 15 yard penalty. So the Steelers literally get 30 yards by doing nothing. They trot out rookie kicker Chris Boswell he calmly drills the game winning field goal and the Steelers walk away with the victory and the Bengals are eliminated in what was their best season since their Super Bowl year. It's I'll just say it bluntly. It's the stupidest collapse in the history of sports.
Steve 69:45
I this is worse than Buckner I can't even think Yeah, or like Jose de la Francesco Berra
Tim 69:54
or, yeah, or the Falcons losing the lead to the pay. I mean, those are all really bad. At least the other team made plays
Steve 70:01
Literally just stood there. Right haven got it.
Tim 70:05
Right and the perfect hit on brown I mean if it if that were any other player because sometimes you know on a play on a bang, bang play over the middle sometimes you hit a guy in the head it's not necessarily on purpose you know, and they're just gonna call anything that's helmet to helmet. But that was that was a perfect plate it wasn't a surprise that he would try to lead with his head you know, and as bad as that was Pac Man Jones I mean, another another fine West Virginia alum you know, what are you doing? Like it's an assistant coach who retired years ago. Why are you getting in a fight with him and why in the in the name of all things holy. Would you throw a punch at him? I mean, it's just the dumbest thing ever. The Bengals have the game one they melt down the hand the Steelers of victory and and you know he talked about they talked about the top five most satisfying wins. This one's in here too. I mean, both of those playoff games in the Bengals against the Bengals were just in my top five most satisfying wins. And yeah, it sucked. You know, brown didn't play the next week. And Ben was hurt and Bell was already hurts. Perfect took out our whole offense that year and we lost the divisional round to Denver in a really close game. However, it was worth it to just beat them in that fashion. Well,
Steve 71:25
if you don't remember Pac Man Jones went on the Dan Patrick show the next week in stated that Antonio Brown was faking a concussion so to be PacMan Jones and the Cincinnati Bengals the Steelers organization literally held him out against Denver just to beat you just to prove a point that he really wasn't concoct what kind of insane a it Dan Patrick sit there and it just like didn't question it just like sat there accepted it with a straight face like I that's still to this day and how many years ago this still annoys me so up wonder why nobody takes the media serious anymore. Yeah. What when you just like crap like that gets said and don't even challenge it. Come on, man. I that's that's the quote. Our current president that's ridiculous, though.
Tim 72:15
Yeah, that that was that was embarrassing. I mean, it was embarrassing enough, the way they lost but then the way they carry themselves afterwards. And then he was also very upset that you know, Porter was even out there, Jeremy. Yeah, Jerry didn't even call him the right name. Was Jerry Porter going out? I mean, it's just, it's just, it was the biggest embarrassment ever. Honestly, how Marvin Lewis was still allowed to be employed after that game is beyond my comprehension for years. For years. Yeah. Yeah. And it just says everything you need to know about the ownership. You know, it's, it's, it's, you know, to do another Simpsons reference, it's Superintendent Chalmers is at the school and the guys like, if they hire Skinner back and he'd been fired, I guess. Somebody like you're really gonna hire that guy back and commerce is like, it seems to know the children's names. And that seems to be seems to be the way that Mike Brown, you know, decided to determine who coached the Bengals because because that was that was the ugliest collapse of all time. And so did Marvin Lewis just had no control over the team. So Bengals fans are understandably devastated. That was their last best chance to win a playoff game. And they haven't even sniffed the postseason since the Bengals last playoff win as we already detailed came in 1990 against the Houston Oilers a team which no longer exists. Speaking of Bengals fans, that game also produced the crying crying Bengals lady mean, it was if you've never seen that it was basically a screenshot that from the end of that game, there was a woman in the stands with tears literally streaming down her face with Bengals gear on and that just became a meme for years and years just blew up in one of those big internet themes. You know, 30 credits he has he has a pretty good sense of humor about it she starts a Twitter feed and an Instagram account as like crying Bengals fan or something like that and gains a lot of followers actually appears in some of Pittsburgh dad's episodes of his YouTube channel so kudos to her she kind of took something that was you know, potentially very embarrassing and and kind of turned it into something fun. You know, and honestly, who hasn't been there where you're devastated by your team's loss especially my god if you're a Bengals fan I can't even imagine
Steve 74:38
Yeah, he just dad This is you you should like file for divorce from your team. You're being abused. you're you're you're just being taken advantage of at this point. It isn't fair as ridiculous.
Tim 74:55
The ugliness between these two teams continues for the next couple of seasons. Since it really culminates in the infamous 2017 Monday night game that we talked about in our previous episode that we did about the 2017 season. It's it's I said it, then I'll say it again, it's the sickest I've ever felt watching a sporting event, just three hours of guys taking headshots, and literally trying to severely injure each other. It also results in Ryan's easier being paralyzed and never playing again. I think the only if there's any good takeaway from that atrocity of a football game, it's that essentially kind of marks the end of that era. Perfect, as we, as we said earlier, is is basically forced out of the league A few years later. And the animosity just kind of simmers down over time. So the 2010s you think about that fierce rivalry, you think about all the dirty hits and all the all the hatred between the two clubs during the 2010s, the Steelers and Bengals played 21 times the Bengals only one three of those. That's that's another thing that I would never have guessed. I just I thought it was a little more evenly matched than that. I know. We've mostly got the best of them. But three times in the whole decade, they beat us, Steve, would you have guessed that?
Steve 76:10
No. I thought they would have won more. But I guess in the 2010s you get a finger point. Yeah. It seems like what Dalton they had a better team. They
Tim 76:19
went to the playoffs six times I yeah. How many times have we go to the playoffs? I mean, not more than that. So yeah, I just it was surprising. I didn't realize they only beat us three times at hope that whole time that will decade so
Steve 76:34
that it is three times and we they play us twice a year. So yeah, and
Tim 76:39
the playoff game, so 21 times that they
Steve 76:43
lost a team of 20. Yep. Yes. I mean, if Jerry Porter wouldn't have been there was Joey Porter. Yeah, I think that playoff win is like one that's gonna haunt their franchise for a while. That's gonna be a tough one to shake off. And you know if they ever do, I don't know.
Tim 77:02
Yeah, yeah. So that, that that's kind of the history of the rivalry. Let's talk a little bit about the future. Right now. The Bengals are building once again. They have a young head coach, they have a potentially generational quarterback and Joe burrow. The Steelers future is is kind of uncertain. You know that Ben Roethlisberger is probably playing in his final season this year. So you know what's gonna happen in the 2020s are to say or to say what's quarterback in?
Steve 77:35
Who's the quarterback of the second game for the Bengals last year, the one where the Bengals one. I don't even I don't even know that guy's name. I mean, the seal is played so bad that game.
Tim 77:47
Jeez, yeah. Yeah, some error not gonna work here anymore. Like that was? That's Yeah, that's somebody that that won't be around too much longer.
Steve 77:59
Yeah, Joe burrow was hurt by that point. Right. Yeah, they actually split the series last season. Somehow the Bengals screw Joe burrow up or something? And he's from Ohio too. So yeah, they got the quarterback and they build the rest of the team around them. So
Tim 78:19
yeah, they got the quarterback they have they have really good young receivers. They just drafted that kid this year. I mean, so you know, it's it's it's kind of like the 90s where they had these top picks for a few years and will will pan out or will well not and Time will tell and then the Steelers obviously tons of question marks there right because it's going to be the end of the Ben Roethlisberger era. And what happens after that we saw what we we definitely saw what happened for the many years between the 70s and Ben where's the Steelers didn't have a franchise quarterback and that you know resulted in some success but never a championship so lots of question marks. But you know, though, there'll be plenty of more Steelers Bengals moments, I'm sure in this series that we plenty more stories and characters. They grow out of this rivalry that's pretty much the guarantee. See if any last thoughts on skewers and Bengals?
Steve 79:16
Hopefully, the Bengals lady doesn't have to cry too much more. But hey, you never know.
Tim 79:24
Oh, well, I kinda hope she does have to cry a lot. You're wishing you know nothing against her personally, but her team will lose a lot. Alright, everybody, thank you so much for listening. Please give us a review. Please tell your friends. Check us out on the web or social media. Those links are all in the show description. Catch you next time.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai